Brake Fluid Information... - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 07:28 PM Thread Starter
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Brake Fluid Information...

Here is some great info from one of the NESBA CRs related to Brake Fluids and what you need to know:

Super Blue! is an excellent and recommended fluid for track and racing.
Not sure if speedwerks has it in stock or not, some info I found online.


The DOT 2 spec is for drum brakes and is obsolete. If you have any DOT 2 in your garage, throw it away! DOT 5 is for silicone brake fluid. Silicone brake fluid (DOT 5) should be avoided because it is not compatible with regular brake fluid, it is hard to pour without introducing bubbles and thus results in soft pedal feel, and moisture still gets into your system and will pool in low areas like your calipers and encourage rapid corrosion. STAY AWAY!

That leaves DOT 3 and DOT 4 fluids. These fluids are compatible with each other and may be interchanged or mixed with no ill effects.

Let's look at some popular brake fluids and their boiling points:


Fluid DRY WET
Castrol LMA DOT 3/4 446 311
Ford Heavy Duty DOT 3 550 290
ATE Super Blue Racing 536 392
ATE TYP 200 536 392
Motul Racing 600 585 421
Castrol SRF 590 518
Performance Friction 550 284

Castrol LMA is very good at rejecting moisture and may be kept in your brake system for a couple years. The LMA stands for "Low Moisture Activity". It comes in plastic containers which do not have a long shelf life. Don't buy lots of this stuff at a time because moisture can make its way through the plastic containers.

Ford Heavy Duty DOT 3 is VERY inexpensive and is popular among racers because of its excellent dry boiling point. It absorbs moisture quickly, but the racers don't care since they change their fluid frequently. Comes in metal cans so it may be stored.

ATE Super Blue Racing and ATE TYP 200 are the same brake fluid in two different colors (blue and amber, respectively). BMW recommends this brake fluid for their street cars because it, like Castrol LMA, absorbs moisture very slowly. The advantage over LMA is that ATE has a much better wet boiling point. You can put this stuff in your car and forget about it for a long time. An excellent choice for a weekend track car which also sees regular street duty. Comes in metal cans.

Motul Racing 600 is a very exotic and expensive synthetic fluid with high wet and dry boiling points. I use this exclusively in my race cars. Too expensive for the street and requires frequent changing due to its hygroscopic nature. Sold in plastic bottles. It is not suitable for the street because it absorbs moisture quickly.

Castrol SRF is a hyper-exotic and hyper-expensive brake fluid that is generally used by wealthy Porsche owners at track events. I've seen prices of $78 per liter for this stuff. Sold in metal cans. I can't afford this stuff!

Performance Friction High Performance DOT 3 has a good dry boiling point but a crummy wet boiling point. It comes in metal cans which is good for shelf life and sells for $7.87 per 16 ounce container. If you are even considering this fluid, I would go with the cheaper Ford Heavy Duty DOT 3. In either case, change this fluid frequently due to the poor wet boiling point.

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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 07:46 PM
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vcook has been rocking ate superblue for years now.

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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 07:48 PM
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Good information, to add to winks post here is a very important one to add.

When is the right time for a track bike to get flushed or bleed out a bit to refresh what FLUID IS IN AND KEPT IN THE CALIPER, which retains ALOT of the heat build up that adds to break fade.

Ive shared this experience and vowed it would never happen to me again.

Road America, T5 using golden specro, breaks were fading before 3 laps towards the end of the weekend.
this time around I squeezed and didnít get hardly any breaking done, I pumped it 2 more times asI down shifted, and still not slowing me down enough from the triple digits entering that turn, "I wasnít going to make it" as I was leaning over I grabbed another down shit and smoothly let it out, it help I almost made it, but leaned over at almost 70mpr and about to hit a 3 inch high rumble strip all I could think was HOLD IT, HOLD the line! As I drifted closer and closer and the thought of me leaned over hitting it sideways the result would throw me and the bike flipping through the air sideways.

So I stood it up at the last second and almost road it out through the pea gravel.

The sum of the story and my suggestion.

Regardless of grade or price of your fluid, change it every weekend if you want to play it super safe.

if not at least change out the fluid after 6 track days, and after each weekend bleed out enough fluid that would fill the caliper. YOU WILL see and notice the refreshed difference even after a weekend worth of hard breaking.
If you donít, then consider the fact of you will never have to experience something like I did, most of all a WORSE experience 1 that goes along with an ambulance ride.

Change your fluid often, bleed them more often.

Speed, hpr, suspension, compound of tires means NOTHING IF YOU CANT STOP!



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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 08:01 PM
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I have and use the Castrol SRF stuff and it rocks. Plus it comes in a quart bottle so I'll have it for a long time.

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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 08:14 PM
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where can you get this superblue???

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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 08:15 PM Thread Starter
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Google...

http://www.google.com/search?client=...UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 08:24 PM
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ATE blue and gold are some favorites in PCA racing (porsche) and track days because you can and should alternate colors so it is obvious when the old dirty fluid is out and the new clean stuff is in. This is very important in sports cars because of the high weight, high braking forces, and low cooling when compared to bikes.

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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 10:45 PM
 
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how long do you guys usually keep a can of brake fluid around?

its not like they sell super small cans of fluid, and ive always heard that once a can of brake fluid has been opened to just throw it away, but i cant bring myself to do that given that i maybe use a 10th of a can filling up my front and rear systems
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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 10:49 PM Thread Starter
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Once opened, I might keep it for a week for when I rebleed. And I always buy the smallest ones I can find.

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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 11:19 PM

 
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I've also heard that you shouldn't keep open bottles very long. They will pull moisture out of the air. I know some racers that only use fresh bottles.


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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:24 AM
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I use Mopar brand DOT 4 brake fluid

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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:33 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoparBoyy
I use Mopar brand DOT 4 brake fluid
Big shocker (pun intended) there...

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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 07:11 AM
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Soooo is this super blue available anywhere locally?




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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 07:51 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTony
Soooo is this super blue available anywhere locally?
check at automotive garages, as said earlier its popular among the car racers
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTony
Soooo is this super blue available anywhere locally?
yes, help me finish off the liter can I have before I toss it at the end of the season. I keep them for one season after opening, and I keep them in a ziplock bag. Not as good as unopened but I'm sure it helps some.

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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:26 PM
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Golden Spectro Supreme DOT 4.....good stuff for a decent price!
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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:52 PM
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I have only street bike and I use DOT5.
No problems yet.

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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 01:17 PM
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Hmmm, I've just been using the Valvoline Synthetic DOT4 for like $2.35 a bottle from Wal-Mart. So far I've never experienced brake fade of any kind on my SV and I use the fluid for a whole season at least. Then again, I don't abuse brakes as much as guys with faster bikes...

The 636 though, I have no idea what brake fluid is in it, but I can definately feel noticable brake fade after the 2nd session in the last half of every session out on the track. I'm thinking about just ditching whatever fluid is in there and trying cheap Valvoline as well and see how it goes

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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 11:24 PM
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Change it every weekend! Shit, I just took the stock stuff out after 18 track days so I could put some Galfer Superbike lines on. The fluid was still clear and had no sponginess.

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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-06-2006, 06:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGrouch
Change it every weekend! Shit, I just took the stock stuff out after 18 track days so I could put some Galfer Superbike lines on. The fluid was still clear and had no sponginess.

your lucky, my tank eats break fluid for breakfest.



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post #21 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-06-2006, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonGu
The 636 though, I have no idea what brake fluid is in it, but I can definately feel noticable brake


Because you don't know what fluid is in it......it's OLD !

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post #22 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-07-2006, 11:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c2000
I have only street bike and I use DOT5.
No problems yet.
did your bike come with dot 5? id stay away form that for any type of brake system unless stock. once that synthetic fluid gets enough moisture in it and heats up its gonna be harder for your master to push it and the air bubbles through. i'd had customers put stuff that they had in the garage for years in their car and make me wonder how they even made it to the shop with no brake pedal. stay with dot 3 or 4 if doing enough track days start changing it regularly it doesnt have to be the high end stuff... just clean out a new bottle. i could even help ppl out around midway if needed.
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post #23 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-08-2006, 07:30 AM Thread Starter
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<--------- recommends against 5. I had lock up with 5.

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post #24 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-08-2006, 08:21 AM
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Good luck guys, I've had this argument with c2000 in other threads and he is pretty set on his choice. Though for the record I'm with you, Dot5 is a poor choice in this application.

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post #25 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-08-2006, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wink
Once opened, I might keep it for a week for when I rebleed. And I always buy the smallest ones I can find.
Brian...try a product called Bloxgen, it's a can of inert gases...nitogen, argon and carbon dioxide..you spray this gas into your container...it's heavier than air...so displaces it, keeps the fluid fresh.

Sometimes goodbye is your second chance.
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post #26 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-08-2006, 09:04 AM Thread Starter
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Sounds kewl...

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post #27 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-08-2006, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickC1957
Brian...try a product called Bloxgen, it's a can of inert gases...nitogen, argon and carbon dioxide..you spray this gas into your container...it's heavier than air...so displaces it, keeps the fluid fresh.
And if the can of Bloxgen happens to release itself while you're sleeping in your enclosed trailer?

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post #28 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-08-2006, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickC1957
Brian...try a product called Bloxgen, it's a can of inert gases...nitogen, argon and carbon dioxide..you spray this gas into your container...it's heavier than air...so displaces it, keeps the fluid fresh.

shit boy, thats called a FART!



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post #29 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-12-2006, 12:50 PM
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I have been using the Motul 600 and havent had aproblem with it. I need to change it though and I plan on using what Drucker said I should use. I am not postive on the brand (I think its maxima) DOT 3.
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post #30 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-12-2006, 12:52 PM Thread Starter
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I have been using the Motul 600 as well, Frank.

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