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post #1 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 08:28 PM Thread Starter
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The State of the Election process.

So I sit here looking over some information on candidates for the upcoming primary. Although I must say it's really hitting home how screwed up our system is. Here I have a list of people, none of them with the integrity or the ethical fortitude to earn even a fraction of my trust to run this great nation. Of the contenders, we have a list of Millionaires who are so out of touch with how the average American lives, they wouldn't know what its like to be short on a mortgage payment and have to scrimp by to make it work in a tough month. But I guess we should all feel for them after all, fuel for their private jets is expensive, I'm sure their accounting teams sweat every time they have to write one of those checks. All of them are mired either financial or sex scandals, throwing mud at each other in 30 second sound bites to make themselves look better, and the Media plays this like commentators at a sporting event. Meanwhile the political junkies of the web sit and argue all day about who's side is worse instead of discussing what can be done to fix the problem. We are all infighting on the same level, while the ruling class steps back and watches us from above. We all need to step back and look at the big picture. There are no republicans, no democrats, we are all just being lead down the primrose path so we can all gather in grant park and cry because we got what we were told we wanted.

Am I the only one who steps back and asks the question, why are these the people we are being made to choose from? How can we expect excellence when we the only choices we are given by the political elite are a complete Joke?




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post #2 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 08:57 PM
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post #3 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:08 PM
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you are not alone. For weeks Ive been wondering how out of touch Romney is with his wealth. I know they're all wealthy but he's over the top.. It tempt's me to not even care to vote.

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post #4 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:14 PM
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chew on this

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post #5 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:18 PM
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They... all... fucking... SUCK!!!
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post #6 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:24 PM
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post #7 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:40 PM Thread Starter
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in theory, just a thought here, with facebook and social media fueling all the shit over seas last spring. what do you think it would take to make everyone stay home from the polls this november in protest?




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post #8 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:42 PM
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Study some history...I mean really get in to it and read through personal memoirs, letters home, memos, speeches...and you'll quickly realize how lacking today's politicians are in comparison with those past. Morons they are...not all, but in general. It's stunning to me how articulate and intelligent so many of the past leaders of this country were, from all parties.

This mechanism in place of corporate funding and HUGE sums of money flying around just didn't exist. Most folks really did come to prominence based on their record. Pedigree played a part certainly, and still does...but everything is so based on hype, empty rhetoric and the media cycle now.

The issues themselves are much the same...the idiots we've got purporting themselves to be the solution is the difference. I honestly don't even pay attention anymore.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacitus
In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.

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post #9 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:49 PM
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maybe the lection should just be held via spacebook? I bet the the voter turnout is double.

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post #10 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 09:50 PM Thread Starter
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I hear ya Cerk. i'm really displeased on how we are letting ourselves be run. I kind of feel like Neo in the matrix.




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Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

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post #11 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 10:07 PM
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Tony, how do you feel about Ron Paul?
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post #12 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by HDTony View Post
I hear ya Cerk. i'm really displeased on how we are letting ourselves be run. I kind of feel like Neo in the matrix.
Everything has just gotten so damn convoluted and misdirected...a giant, ever-speaking media needs things to discuss and it never stops looking for new angles. Most of which, at the end of the day, really don't matter. All of these social issues, sidebars...so much bullcrap to sift through to even figure anything out! It's exhausting.

At the end of the day, it's pretty simple.

1. How big should government be?
2. How will you protect the country, both ideologically and physically?
3. How much money do I get to keep?

That's it. Break that down for me and shut up. Either that or just make a quick reference card for me so I can just turn CNN/FOX/MSNBC off and save my stress level.

Tom

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacitus
In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #13 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 10:08 PM
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So I sit here looking over some information on candidates for the upcoming primary. Although I must say it's really hitting home how screwed up our system is. Here I have a list of people, none of them with the integrity or the ethical fortitude to earn even a fraction of my trust to run this great nation. Of the contenders, we have a list of Millionaires who are so out of touch with how the average American lives, they wouldn't know what its like to be short on a mortgage payment and have to scrimp by to make it work in a tough month. But I guess we should all feel for them after all, fuel for their private jets is expensive, I'm sure their accounting teams sweat every time they have to write one of those checks. All of them are mired either financial or sex scandals, throwing mud at each other in 30 second sound bites to make themselves look better, and the Media plays this like commentators at a sporting event. Meanwhile the political junkies of the web sit and argue all day about who's side is worse instead of discussing what can be done to fix the problem. We are all infighting on the same level, while the ruling class steps back and watches us from above. We all need to step back and look at the big picture. There are no republicans, no democrats, we are all just being lead down the primrose path so we can all gather in grant park and cry because we got what we were told we wanted.

Am I the only one who steps back and asks the question, why are these the people we are being made to choose from? How can we expect excellence when we the only choices we are given by the political elite are a complete Joke?
I know what you mean, it's frustrating. Even worse is 550 of these assholes are in charge of the country and our well being. (thats all three branches of government) However I don't want an average "Joe" running the country either. Look at where a guy with no business experience got us... This country is the world biggest economy and we need someone with experience.

The best canidate would have qualities from all four front runners:

1) Gingrich - most experienced foreign policy, proven ability to work with both sides of the aisle, most political experience and knowledge of history, what works and what doesn't.
2) Romney - most business experience, knows how to make a pheonix rise from the ashes
3) Paul - I like his small government ideas, but goes overboard on abolishion of the Department of Ed, FBI, CIA, and his foreign policy is borderline reckless.
4) Santorum - Middle of the road , slightly older fashion converative, does not seem corrupted by politics....

The good news is we CAN elect anyone walking down the street and he or she will do a better job than Obama.
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post #14 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 10:27 PM Thread Starter
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Tony, how do you feel about Ron Paul?
he has some good points, but he's off base on some stuff, which will keep him from ever getting into office.




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post #15 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 10:51 PM
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what do you think it would take to make everyone stay home from the polls this november in protest?

Not much I'm guessing, when you look at the our voting turnout rates. I'm guessing a really really juicy episode of The Kardasians could do it.
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post #16 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 10:54 PM
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there is a guy running in the independent party, who is a middle aged middle class average joe


problem with he independent party, is there isnt any exposure to these people. And very hard for them to win.



My belief is we should cap people on how long they serve in congress. And an easy way to kick them out of office for corruption. Not like in Chicago with the Aldermans giving handouts to their family.
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post #17 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 11:56 PM Thread Starter
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My belief is we should cap people on how long they serve in congress.
really? wel damn your right! maybe we should have congress vote on throwing themselves out of office! ya, that'll work




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post #18 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 12:04 AM
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really? wel damn your right! maybe we should have congress vote on throwing themselves out of office! ya, that'll work

somehow they did pass a bill, that they will not get a raise for a while.



maybe after that, they will get a 20% raise.
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post #19 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 12:06 AM
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....The good news is we CAN elect anyone walking down the street and he or she will do a better job than Obama.
And that's the way we need to approach this election. True that our selection on the Republican side is not what we'd hope or expect for various reasons but the most important thing right now is to get the White House out of the hands of such radical zealots who want to re- invent the USA and make it resemble a Socialist Democrat European nation!
I haven't decided who will get my vote in the Illinois primary but I can assure you that whoever is the GOP nominee will have my full support in November!

We need to take this one step at a time and remember that the political system of this country is supposed to work on compromise. One thing is sure right now...there is absolutely NO compromise from those holding the White House right now and we need to send them packing and send a clear message that it may take some time to get things as they should be but, we're damn sure not going to let them continue to go the way they've been going these last 4 years! Just moving Obama out (especially in the atmoshere that there is NO WAY he can lose that his supporters believe) in one term will put some of the other political class on notice that the people are coming around and ultimately in control!
We made a statement that caught them off guard 2 years ago in the mid term...we need to stay the course in this Presidential election to put ALL of them...both sides of the aisle... on notice that WE are in charge.
At this point change... ANY change in the executive branch is good and we can't allow our frustration to derail what MUST be done!

The pendulum IS swinging in the right direction...we NEED to keep it going! If for no other reason than to stop Obama from making any more appointments to the Supreme Court!!!

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post #20 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 12:18 AM
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in theory, just a thought here, with facebook and social media fueling all the shit over seas last spring. what do you think it would take to make everyone stay home from the polls this November in protest?
If we do this, then the nutjobs on both extremes will decide who has power. I'm not willing to abdicate my infinitesimal amount of control to nutjobs on either side of the spectrum.

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post #21 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 08:32 AM
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I've been pondering this for few years now. With social media today how hard would it be to get a candidate in the spotlight with little to no campaign budget?

Here's the other problem.....

If we did get a person elected and they did what needed to be done they would obviously never be re-elected. We need someone to make hard/un-popular decisions.

btw.....don't let the campaign rhetoric fool you. Romney is not as out of touch as the media leads on. We forget sometimes we built this country on competition. Competition means someone loses. This needs to be controlled to a point, but we can't be the best country in the world if there is no incentive to work or innovate. There has to be winners and losers....period

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post #22 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 08:59 AM Thread Starter
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I'd take the job for one term. I think this could a really fun experiment!




HDTony.... Damn glad to meet you!

Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

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post #23 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 09:18 AM
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btw.....don't let the campaign rhetoric fool you. Romney is not as out of touch as the media leads on. We forget sometimes we built this country on competition. Competition means someone loses. This needs to be controlled to a point, but we can't be the best country in the world if there is no incentive to work or innovate. There has to be winners and losers....period
Exactly, "Personal Incentive" is now and what has always separated our economic system from most others.

The government's job, if it has one in regulating the economy, is to ensure a level STARTING POINT for everyone...it's job is NOT to dictate outcomes. There's a huge difference there.

Some of the very greatest people in our country's history (most actually) came from very humble beginnings. The only way that changes is by handing more and more power to the ruling elite in the name of "fairness". It's happened so many times before, only through ignorance of history do people continue to fall for it.

Ahhhh, the promise of a free ride

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Quote:
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In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #24 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 09:38 AM
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Let's make it illegal for any donations to either party and publicly fund the people running. This will make anyone running honest and not kiss any special interest ass. You do not owe anyone any favors if they did not help buy your seat. This alone will keep much of the Rich ruling classes interest out. Imagine energy, big pharma, banks and insurance companies not being able to buy votes and judges anymore by donating billions to the candidate that will vote their way.

While we are at it lets have an atheist run. Yes, I know I am dreaming. Just scares me that some people vote based on someones religious beliefs. Fine for positions in a church but not for running a country unless you are a radical Muslim nation (yes it is the same mentality, god before everything else).
Things are still messed up but definitely improving, I believe we have the best person for the job right now in office.

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post #25 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 09:43 AM
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Frankly I couldn't care less what a person's religious beliefs are as long as they have like minded economic approaches....but for some people, religion is important and there's not a thing wrong with that. Why does that bother you? Why is it different from people voting based on political affiliation or social issues?

Come on...that's being pretty hypocritical, I think.

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Quote:
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post #26 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 10:00 AM
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I'd take the job for one term. I think this could a really fun experiment!
You can have it! I'd love to be an economic advisor though.

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Frankly I couldn't care less what a person's religious beliefs are as long as they have like minded economic approaches....but for some people, religion is important and there's not a thing wrong with that. Why does that bother you? Why is it different from people voting based on political affiliation or social issues?

Come on...that's being pretty hypocritical, I think.
Social issues are real. You can see results of economic approaches, can see the results of funding projects or military training. The danger is when leaders start basing decisions on religion which is not rational, you cannot scientifically prove one imaginary power or another's and to base actions that affect real people on these does not sit well with me. To me it would be like basing my vote primarily on what color the candidate likes the best. It has no relevance. Religion often divides people rather than unites at least in the sense of one group against another for their beliefs. We have enough dividers here, male/female, rich/middle/poor, old/young, black/white etc.....
Religion combined with politics more than anything is one of those things that for centuries has caused more wars and bad policies. Keep religion out and just focus on people as whole regardless of what they do in private.

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post #28 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
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Social issues are real. You can see results of economic approaches, can see the results of funding projects or military training. The danger is when leaders start basing decisions on religion which is not rational, you cannot scientifically prove one imaginary power or another's and to base actions that affect real people on these does not sit well with me. To me it would be like basing my vote primarily on what color the candidate likes the best. It has no relevance. Religion often divides people rather than unites at least in the sense of one group against another for their beliefs. We have enough dividers here, male/female, rich/middle/poor, old/young, black/white etc.....
Religion combined with politics more than anything is one of those things that for centuries has caused more wars and bad policies. Keep religion out and just focus on people as whole regardless of what they do in private.
I'm not even touching this post

Tom

Quote:
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In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #29 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
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Social issues are there for the exact reason I made this post, to keep us arguing amongst ourselves, so we don't step back and look at the big picture. They are not even worth arguing as they are just a tool to control us.




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Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

- Ronald Reagan

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post #30 of 53 (permalink) Old 02-03-2012, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
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Location: Plainfield IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meulen View Post
You can have it! I'd love to be an economic advisor though.
Your hired!




HDTony.... Damn glad to meet you!

Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

- Ronald Reagan

AirTek Heating & Air inc.
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