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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 01:30 PM Thread Starter
Eat a bag o' dix!
 
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http://www.aclu.org/indefinite-deten...horization-act

Quote:
February 22, 2012

On December 31, 2011, President Obama signed the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA), codifying indefinite military detention without charge or trial into law for the first time in American history. The NDAA’s dangerous detention provisions would authorize the president — and all future presidents — to order the military to pick up and indefinitely imprison people captured anywhere in the world, far from any battlefield.
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The breadth of the NDAA’s worldwide detention authority violates the Constitution and international law because it is not limited to people captured in an actual armed conflict, as required by the laws of war. Under the Bush administration, similar claims of worldwide detention authority were used to hold even a U.S. citizen captured on U.S. soil in military custody, and many in Congress assert that the NDAA should be used in the same way. The ACLU does not believe that the NDAA authorizes military detention of American citizens or anyone else in the United States. Any president’s claim of domestic military detention authority under the NDAA would be unconstitutional and illegal. Nevertheless, there is substantial public debate around whether the NDAA could be read even to repeal the Posse Comitatus Act and authorize indefinite military detention without charge or trial within the United States.

Although President Obama issued a signing statement saying he had “serious reservations” about the NDAA’s detention provisions, the statement only applies to how his administration would use them, and would not affect how the law is interpreted by subsequent administrations. The provisions – which were negotiated by a small group of members of Congress, in secret, and without proper congressional review – are inconsistent with fundamental American values.

Both Congress and the president need to clean up the mess they have created. No one should live in fear of this or any future president misusing the NDAA’s detention authority. The NDAA’s detention provisions must be repealed.
Quote:
On December 31, 2011, President Obama signed the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA), codifying indefinite military detention without charge or trial into law for the first time in American history. (To learn more about the NDAA, visit www.aclu.org/NDAA).

The law is an historic threat because it codifies indefinite military detention without charge or trial into law for the first time in American history. It could permit the president – and all future presidents – to order the military to imprison indefinitely civilians captured far from any battlefield without charge or trial.

This kind of sweeping detention power is completely at odds with our American values, violates the Constitution, and corrodes our Nation’s commitment to the rule of law, which generations have fought to preserve.

The breadth of the NDAA’s worldwide detention authority violates the Constitution and international law because it is not limited to people captured in an actual armed conflict, as required by the laws of war.

Under the Bush administration, claims of worldwide detention authority were used to hold even a U.S. citizen captured on U.S. soil in military custody, and many in Congress assert that the NDAA should be used in the same way. The ACLU does not believe that the NDAA authorizes military detention of American citizens or anyone else in the United States. Any president’s claim of domestic military detention authority under the NDAA would be unconstitutional and illegal.

Nevertheless, there is substantial public debate and uncertainty around whether Sections 1021 and 1022 of the NDAA could be read even to repeal the Posse Comitatus Act and authorize indefinite military detention without charge or trial within the United States.

The law does not require even an allegation that a detained person caused any harm or threat of harm to the United States or to any U.S. interest. Mere allegation of membership in, or support of, an alleged terrorist group could be the basis for indefinite detention. Under the American justice system, we don’t just lock people up indefinitely based on suspicion.

Congress and the president should clean up the mess they created. Congress should repeal the NDAA’s detention provisions.

More than ten years after the 9/11 attacks, with the United States withdrawing from Iraq and Afghanistan, the United States should not be asserting new worldwide authority for the military to imprison persons seized in any country.

We have seen how disregard for the rule of law has disastrous results for America’s standing in the world. It is time for a return to the rule of law. It is time to turn that page.

Tons of more info out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki047 View Post
As long as their tits are bigger than their dicks, im in.

-"You will meet your destiny on the road of avoidance."

-"Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, and today is a gift. That is why we call it the present."

-"It's not considered premarital sex if you don't plan on getting married."
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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 01:37 PM
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The ACLU is as jacked as this provision.

Messed up. Can you imagine the media response if there were an R after BO's name instead of a D?

Tom

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacitus
In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Cerk View Post
The ACLU is as jacked as this provision.

Messed up. Can you imagine the media response if there were an R after BO's name instead of a D?
Gotta agree with you there. Where is the news coverage on this??

This is a pretty f*cked up law that BO signed.

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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 02:01 PM
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It doesn't fit with the narrative Chris, and so it's not covered. This is the unfortunate reality of our once great media.

Tom

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacitus
In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 02:03 PM
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I've got both FNC and CNN on in my office and neither has covered it. I would think Murdoch would be all over this.

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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 02:03 PM
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US media = report as needed .
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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 02:14 PM
Go ahead, I'll catch up
 
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This is old news. It was reported back when it happened.

Take care and ride safe,
Brian
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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 02:19 PM
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Its only 2 months old..... so the ACLU is late in throwing a hissy fit.

Never a bad time to climb... unless the weather is really horrible, and then you climb inside!

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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 02:52 PM Thread Starter
Eat a bag o' dix!
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brilama View Post
This is old news. It was reported back when it happened.

Take care and ride safe,
Brian
Why didn't you inform us then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki047 View Post
As long as their tits are bigger than their dicks, im in.

-"You will meet your destiny on the road of avoidance."

-"Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, and today is a gift. That is why we call it the present."

-"It's not considered premarital sex if you don't plan on getting married."
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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 03:17 PM
d0 work s0n!
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trkyleg View Post
Why didn't you inform us then?
Everyone was more worried about SOPA and PIPA because it affects the internetz. I mean detention can't be that bad, right?

Taxpayers Foot $750,000 Soccer Field for Guantanamo Detaineesl


FYI, NDAA takes effect this week.

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when i start to come undone, stitch me together.
when you see me stretched remind me of what left this outlaw torn."
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 03:48 PM
Go ahead, I'll catch up
 
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Why didn't you inform us then?
I was hiding in my bomb shelter.
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 03:49 PM Thread Starter
Eat a bag o' dix!
 
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yeah no shit. i wish i had one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki047 View Post
As long as their tits are bigger than their dicks, im in.

-"You will meet your destiny on the road of avoidance."

-"Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, and today is a gift. That is why we call it the present."

-"It's not considered premarital sex if you don't plan on getting married."
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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 04:12 PM
Go ahead, I'll catch up
 
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Quote:
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yeah no shit. i wish i had one.
I actually do. The guy who built my house had a bomb shelter added in the backyard during the Kennedy/Castro crisis.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 04:28 PM
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I can't remember if was on the media. I do know all the nutjobs were talking about it on youtube.


just seems no different than the patriot act.
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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 05:44 PM
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Jake Tapper, the White House correspondent for ABC News, pointed out that the administration had lauded brave reporting in distant lands more than once and then asked, “How does that square with the fact that this administration has been so aggressively trying to stop aggressive journalism in the United States by using the Espionage Act to take whistle-blowers to court?”

He then suggested that the administration seemed to believe that “the truth should come out abroad; it shouldn’t come out here.”

Fair point. The Obama administration, which promised during its transition to power that it would enhance “whistle-blower laws to protect federal workers,” has been more prone than any administration in history in trying to silence and prosecute federal workers.


http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/27/bu...&smid=fb-share


this is bigger and will affect us more,, unless obummer puts us all in fema camps for our thought crimes
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-29-2012, 09:43 PM
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$4 gas. It's likely all over for him, fair or not.

Tom

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacitus
In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 03-01-2012, 09:44 AM
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$4 gas. It's likely all over for him, fair or not.
I don't know, dude. $4 gas might not be around by November, and the American public is VERY fickle, has a short attention span, and doesn't dig deep to see the reason behind issues.

All that has to happen for the public to forget about the pain at the pump is for gas prices to ease by early October. That's after the driving season, and when a lot of stations switch to cheaper gas, and hopefully fears about Iran will subside (the last one being the least likely).

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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 03-01-2012, 10:08 AM
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Very few people make any decisions in the election after about August...really, 6 months ahead of time. The vast majority of the public has made up their mind way before the election. That's why they all hit it so hard so early. Last minute campaigning is always in battleground areas where a few thousand votes either way make the difference.

Tom

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacitus
In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 03-01-2012, 10:31 AM
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You make a good point. The nation is pretty divided again this year, and it seems more polarized with fewer moderates and fence-sitters. So it would appear that most people have already made up their minds.

The high gas prices will definitely come up in debates and the attack ads, but when they drop (because they will) by the Fall the Republicans won't be able to use that point of leverage.

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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 03-01-2012, 10:34 AM
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That's what I'm saying though, by the fall it won't matter anymore. ...and I honestly don't think the Republicans even need to touch the gas price thing verbally, it speaks for itself...people vote with their wallets more than anything, and high gas prices take aim squarely there.

What is it, for every $0.50 of gas price increase the GDP decreases by 1%?

Tom

Quote:
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In a state where corruption abounds, laws must be very numerous.
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post #21 of 21 (permalink) Old 03-01-2012, 10:36 AM
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Yeah, it's something like that. I think for every penny gas goes up that's about $1M per day more on gas American spend.

The good news is that our gasoline consumption has dropped... but with the strengthening economy I think it'll start going back up.

As for the attack ads, you're right the Republicans won't need to use it. But you can bet your Buell they will. In all fairness the Democrats would use it if the situation were reversed.

Never a bad time to climb... unless the weather is really horrible, and then you climb inside!

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