How often do you change your plug in a 2T? - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-22-2014, 03:03 PM Thread Starter
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How often do you change your plug in a 2T?

I've been changing plugs every 1.5-2 hours. Basically every hare scramble at FVOR I run a new plug. Is this overkill in a 250 2 stroke?

I'm still pretty new to dirtbikes so I don't have much for comparison. I've only fouled 1 plug and it was only a fun day not a race. I pretty much told myself that I'll never let that happen again. At $3-5 per plug (NGK), it's not breaking the bank and I've always convinced myself that it's cheap insurance.

What are your plug change intervals?
Bike type and size?
Riding style?
Anything else that would play a factor?

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-22-2014, 03:13 PM
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I think I put one in my ktm at the beginning of last season.

That makes once in a hundred hours or so.
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-22-2014, 03:24 PM
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a bike that is running well will not foul plugs. as stated above you can go a hundred hours or more.

i had an electrical issue that was causing my bike to eat plugs like joey chestnut.

solved the issue (weak stator) and never had another fouled plug.

as far as interval i may change them when i do the top end. or not. doesnt matter really. i just keep one with me all the time.

what may cause it:

-rich jetting
-crank seals
-weak spark
-being fat or ugly
-being a fucking lazy slob about cleaning your air filter
-not enough red meat

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I agree completely with Steve (nouseforaname)
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-22-2014, 03:28 PM
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btw dont believe the line about you need to be fucking pinned all the time. you can putt a 2t all day if its jetted properly. ride with this crowd and you will become a believer lol!

also make sure you warm up your bike. a 2t needs to be warmed up just as much as a 4t.

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I agree completely with Steve (nouseforaname)
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-22-2014, 04:49 PM
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I change mine maybe once a year.

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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nouseforaname View Post
you can putt a 2t all day if its jetted properly. ride with this crowd and you will become a believer lol!
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 11:18 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nouseforaname View Post
a bike that is running well will not foul plugs. as stated above you can go a hundred hours or more.
I guess this is my biggest problem. I'm still not 100% sure that it's jetted properly. It runs fine for me (I think) but I'm still a newbee so what do I know?

I gotta get in touch with some of you guys at the next races. I need a more experienced second opinion. Tuning a bike is difficult when the only time you get to ride is at a race. I don't get the benefit of trial and error or trying a couple different set-ups on a fun ride day.

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GotZuk? View Post
I guess this is my biggest problem. I'm still not 100% sure that it's jetted properly. It runs fine for me (I think) but I'm still a newbee so what do I know?

I gotta get in touch with some of you guys at the next races. I need a more experienced second opinion. Tuning a bike is difficult when the only time you get to ride is at a race. I don't get the benefit of trial and error or trying a couple different set-ups on a fun ride day.

Dave

i hear ya. jetting is tricky till you do a little research, a little trial and error, a little more research, a little cursing, a little more research, and then you start to get it and wonder what the big deal was the whole time.

you just can feel how the bike reacts and know what to do. the smaller bore the bike the more finicky they can be. but it all depends.

and dont go by what settings people tell you to run as far as clip and sizes. it all depends on your riding style and weight! people underestimate how much of a factor weight plays.

learn to read plugs, learn about what jets affect what throttle position, and just think about how the bike reacts to what position of the throttle.

like i said when its foreign its complicated. once you understand the mechanism its not so bad.

also you could have bad reeds. take a look. take the carb off and get used to the parts. make sure they are clean.

hope some of this helps. good luck. if you have more questions or need more help feel free to ask away.

"Why are all these people here? There are too many people on this earth. We need a new plague…"

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Originally Posted by JRobbins View Post
I agree completely with Steve (nouseforaname)
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 04:08 PM
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What's it like to be so cool? Pretty awesome I bet.
im not sure what you mean by this. im just trying to help a fellow motorcylist. i never said i wasnt included in this crowd.

maybe you carry a lot of hate in your heart and it forces you to see everything through a negative spectrum.

try to let go of your negative thoughts. dont be burdened by sorrow. its no way to live

"Why are all these people here? There are too many people on this earth. We need a new plague…"

"Thats it, nobody gets out of here alive."

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRobbins View Post
I agree completely with Steve (nouseforaname)
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 04:35 PM
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I think it's a reflection of how poorly his 2t idles

Chris
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 09:49 PM
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Regarding jetting, here are a couple links I have book marked that should help out.

Setting float height: http://www.allthingsmoto.com/forums/...mentary-13608/

Jetting: http://users.conwaycorp.net/virtus/p...ed/jetting.htm


I haven't owned a 2T longer than a year yet. With the current bike(plan on keeping for a long time), I don't plan on changing plugs more than once a year unless needed.

-Chris
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-24-2014, 09:54 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hman675 View Post
Regarding jetting, here are a couple links I have book marked that should help out.

Setting float height: http://www.allthingsmoto.com/forums/...mentary-13608/

Jetting: http://users.conwaycorp.net/virtus/p...ed/jetting.htm
I rebuilt the carb over this past winter. Tore it down, baked it clean and used a rebuild kit. I believe the carb is in good shape. I did change the jets based on recomendations from the Suzuki service manual and also FMF Exhaust's web site. I cleaned the reeds but did not replace them.

I don't really have a good reference for what is considered "normal". My plug is black and oily after an hour or two but is it necessarily fouled up? My white tail plastic is always oily after a ride. Does this indicate too much spooge or running too rich or perfectly normal for a 2-smoke? I run full synthetic at around 50:1 for what it's worth.

This is where experience pays off. Knowing what is considered normal. It gets frustrating because I'd much rather be riding than tinkering. Maybe I got into the wrong sport LOL?

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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-24-2014, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GotZuk? View Post
I rebuilt the carb over this past winter. Tore it down, baked it clean and used a rebuild kit. I believe the carb is in good shape. I did change the jets based on recomendations from the Suzuki service manual and also FMF Exhaust's web site. I cleaned the reeds but did not replace them.
How did the reeds look? Obviously you would have noticed any chips but did you check to make sure they were sealing well?

Did you check the float height during the rebuild?

How many turns out is your air screw and how did you come to that setting? Did you follow a procedure like that mentioned in the second link I posted? That's a good place to start to determine if you have the correct pilot jet size.

I rode a '98 KX250 last season for woods use and if you ride like I did with a 250 MXer, you probably spend the majority of your time below half throttle...or maybe you don't. Who knows? Getting the pj sized right and needle position set is crucial for good low-mid performance, especially if that's where you spend most of your time riding. I believe my KX was used for ice racing and was jetted richer(several sizes up from stock) when I picked it up. Fouled plugs occasionally early on so I went back to the stock jet sizes and tuned from there. Spent part of a day at FVOR screwing with it tuning the AS and eventually dropped the needle one clip from stock. I probably could have dropped another size on the pilot. It still was by no means perfect but it was no longer fouling plugs. It started up easily, idled smooth, had crisper throttle response and felt strong through the entire rev range. Still on the rich side but was good enough for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GotZuk? View Post
My white tail plastic is always oily after a ride. Does this indicate too much spooge or running too rich or perfectly normal for a 2-smoke? I run full synthetic at around 50:1 for what it's worth.
Everyone has their own opinions on what ratio to run. Have you always ran 50:1 or did you change from some other ratio along the way? Whatever you decide to run ratio wise, stick to it. Don't change it to solve jetting issues.

My KX still spooged. Occasionally enough to produce a light spray on the rear fender. Didn't make a difference with fresh packing either. As long as the bike ran well to my expectations, it didn't bother me. The KTM 150 on the other hand produces very little. Just enough to coat a small area around the very tip of the silencer. No spray anywhere. Two different animals though that get ridden very differently so that could have an effect.

-Chris
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-24-2014, 03:16 PM
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remember that the leaner ratio you go premix with the richer the mixture actually is.

with my 125s i would run 32:1

with a 250 40:1 is pretty good medium imo. 50:1 is okay.

as far as oil residue. yes some is normal. it depends on your riding conditions. if you are full on the main jet it will burn off. when in on off throttle situations (normal riding) the chamber temp cools off and that is what jetting all comes down to. its all about chamber temp. the more fuel you have the cooler environment you produce in the chamber.

people always tend to blame premix oil. it doesnt come down to that at all. it comes down to air vs fuel. the leaner you make the mixture with premix the more parts fuel you have.

as far as plug...

you are looking at the insulator. you want a nice tan brown. whitish is too lean. wet black is too rich. but then again your can have a wet plug doesnt mean it will foul. and also keep in mind when checking the plug its mostly for checking your main jet and killing the bike after running full main. you cant set the pilot circuit to have a perfect looking plug. the bike just doest generate the proper heat.

its when you open and close the throttle that you are getting spurts of rich fuel and a cooling chamber. and that when you experience the real tuning aspect. you want a bike that is crisp but not to the point where it is lean. when it comes to jetting there are thousands of setting changes you can do, jets, float, slide, clips. the combinations are endless. you need to break it down by throttle position.

post very specifically when the plug fouls. what are you doing. on the gas? how long have you been riding before it occurs.

describe as specifically as you can everything thats going on.

also what bike/year/overall mechanical. is it tip top otherwise?

"Why are all these people here? There are too many people on this earth. We need a new plague…"

"Thats it, nobody gets out of here alive."

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRobbins View Post
I agree completely with Steve (nouseforaname)

Last edited by nouseforaname; 07-24-2014 at 03:20 PM.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-24-2014, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GotZuk? View Post
I rebuilt the carb over this past winter. Tore it down, baked it clean and used a rebuild kit. I believe the carb is in good shape. I did change the jets based on recomendations from the Suzuki service manual and also FMF Exhaust's web site. I cleaned the reeds but did not replace them.

I don't really have a good reference for what is considered "normal". My plug is black and oily after an hour or two but is it necessarily fouled up? My white tail plastic is always oily after a ride. Does this indicate too much spooge or running too rich or perfectly normal for a 2-smoke? I run full synthetic at around 50:1 for what it's worth.

This is where experience pays off. Knowing what is considered normal. It gets frustrating because I'd much rather be riding than tinkering. Maybe I got into the wrong sport LOL?
why did you change the jets?
from what to what?
what did the bike run like before?
after?

manufacture recommendations can be way off. depends on the bike/year. jetting is all relative to you. you can have two fast riders that weight the same but ride in a different way and thus run different jetting. granted we are talking about fouling plugs..

does the bike run perfectly?

in my case my bike ran perfect but fouled plugs because the spark was just too weak. it did spark. to the eye it was fine. i went crazy leaning the jetting. made the bike run like shit and fouled more plugs than ever. it was pretty much a nightmare till i found the problem. then poof. never another prob.

i want to help because i know how frustrating this can be. i wound up changing out all the electrical components one by one...

"Why are all these people here? There are too many people on this earth. We need a new plague…"

"Thats it, nobody gets out of here alive."

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRobbins View Post
I agree completely with Steve (nouseforaname)

Last edited by nouseforaname; 07-24-2014 at 03:28 PM.
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