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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 04:54 PM Thread Starter

 
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Need Some Electrical Car Help

Anybody available this weekend to stop by and take a look at my Vette? Willing to pay in cash (or the obligatory CLSB beer and pizza), whatever you prefer.

Long story short, I've got a 1975 Vette whose fans have never worked (just got the car in February). I've got an upgraded dual fan setup, that was setup on a ghetto rigged switch. I purchased a new temp reading setup that should turn the fans on at 195. I've got it wired per the instructions, showing power, and for what I can tell they should now be working...but are not.

If anyone has the time/desire to come over and take a look, please let me know.

Thanks!!

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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 08:35 PM
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Does the fan turn on when the a/c is used?
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 09:13 PM Thread Starter

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave13 View Post
Does the fan turn on when the a/c is used?
The A/C has been removed from the car.

The old fan switch setup had a probe attached to the radiator to read temp, and a dial to set it at which temp you'd want the fans to turn on.

The fans never turned on on their own, only if you turned the dial all the way to the "constant on" position. So, I know the fans do in fact work, just never worked when they hit a certain temp.

After discussing it with some guys on a corvette forum, I decided to strip that a switch setup as it was kind of ghetto put together, for one that a lot of the guys use. Seemed simple enough, hooked up as I should have per instructions, but still not getting the fans to kick in on their own...so now I'm lost.

Peter Katowicz
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 09:19 PM
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Bad relay?

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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 10:14 PM Thread Starter

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michowski View Post
Bad relay?
It's possible...but, I just installed a whole new setup (here's a link to what it is).

Possible that the old relay is bad, and the new is bad...but also since it's a 2 fan setup, and each fan has it's own, I'd think at least 1 would be good.

Also thinking maybe the new temp sensor is bad, unlikely but possible, but anyone know how I would check/determine that?

Basically this, but 2 of them.

http://www.a1electric.com/Merchant2/...uct_Code=195FH

Peter Katowicz
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 11:21 PM
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By pass the temp sensor by turning ign on. Then place the sending unit wire grey to ground. This should trigger the relay and turn the fan on. If this does not work then You have a faulty relay or you are not getting power to it.

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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 06:00 AM
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Where do you have the temp sensor mounted?

Do you have access to a test light?

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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 08:14 AM
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Is your cooling system full of water, I have seen air bubbles and low fluid level cause funky temp sensor readings.

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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MM Racing View Post
Is your cooling system full of water, I have seen air bubbles and low fluid level cause funky temp sensor readings.
Yeah that would be my first question - are we sure the temp sensor is reading 195F? The rest of the items in the circuit can be easily tested with a multimeter.

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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki047 View Post
Yeah that would be my first question - are we sure the temp sensor is reading 195F? The rest of the items in the circuit can be easily tested with a multimeter.
The temp sensor just connects to ground when 195 is temp is hit. If he manually grounds that wire the fans should work if the temp sensor was the faulty part of the circuit.

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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richfiero View Post
The temp sensor just connects to ground when 195 is temp is hit. If he manually grounds that wire the fans should work if the temp sensor was the faulty part of the circuit.
Agreed (or he has bad fans)

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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 09:52 AM Thread Starter

 
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Thanks folks.

I will give this a try and see how it reads running the grey (temp sensor line) to ground.

Also, I do have a test light and multimeter (limited knowledge on the use of that multimeter, but I'm learning).

Peter Katowicz
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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 09:53 AM Thread Starter

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MM Racing View Post
Is your cooling system full of water, I have seen air bubbles and low fluid level cause funky temp sensor readings.
Yes, full of water.

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 09:58 AM
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A test light is your cheap and easy 12v multimeter. First make sure you have power to the correct terminals when key on. If you do, then ground the wire to the temp sensor. If your fans turn on, make sure the cooling system is properly bled. I'm guessing you have it in the intake?

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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 10:21 AM Thread Starter

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alocker View Post
Where do you have the temp sensor mounted?

Do you have access to a test light?
The temp sensor is mounted in the temperature/thermometer neck. Here's a pic. Note, the wires aren't mounted permanently, rather, they're all hooked up but not trimmed or ran correctly until I know it's working right.


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post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 10:30 AM
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Yes, please take the extra time to terminate and solder the connections when the system is working.

In Vettes, the T-stat housing can be the highest point in the system. Newer ones have bleed valves there. After you determined the fans turn on with ground, start the car and warm it up. Crack the temp sender and make sure you get some coolant seepage, confirming its bled.

Feel free to pm me for my phone, I have been working on old GM's for a long time.

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post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 10:34 AM Thread Starter

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alocker View Post
Yes, please take the extra time to terminate and solder the connections when the system is working.

In Vettes, the T-stat housing can be the highest point in the system. Newer ones have bleed valves there. After you determined the fans turn on with ground, start the car and warm it up. Crack the temp sender and make sure you get some coolant seepage, confirming its bled.

Feel free to pm me for my phone, I have been working on old GM's for a long time.
Thanks for all the help.

I'll check with this stuff early this afternoon and report back. Much appreciated.

Peter Katowicz
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post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PolishPete View Post
The temp sensor is mounted in the temperature/thermometer neck. Here's a pic. Note, the wires aren't mounted permanently, rather, they're all hooked up but not trimmed or ran correctly until I know it's working right.

Where is the factory temp gauge sensor located? I would attempt to run a T at the location instead of the T-Stat neck like you have it. Are you sure the T-stat is actually working and coolant is actually flowing past the sensor?

Ian
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post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 02:31 PM Thread Starter

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MM Racing View Post
Where is the factory temp gauge sensor located? I would attempt to run a T at the location instead of the T-Stat neck like you have it. Are you sure the T-stat is actually working and coolant is actually flowing past the sensor?
I'm sure there's water running there as the first time I didn't have it screwed down quite enough and there was some water leakage from there.

Factory temp gauge is located in the side of the motor, not sure it'd be possible to T off of it.

The setup I've got connected now is ran by a lot of corvette guys once they upgrade their fans to a dual fan system.

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post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-29-2011, 04:07 PM Thread Starter

 
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Problem solved. For now. Hope that doesn't change.

So I took the recommendation and grounded the grey temp wire. Turned the key, and the fans didn't come on.

So, I go back and check power with my light. Power coming from the alternator to the relays. My assumption was that the alternator provided power for everything, but then again, why did there need to be a connection to "ignition"? Answering that answered the problem I think.

I checked power to the fans, of course no power, since they weren't on. So I checked power going back from the relays to the "ignition" source. Nothing. Followed that back to the firewall, then into the drivers side and fuse box. The line goes into the fuse box, and has an inline 30 amp fuse on the cable itself. I thought maybe that went, but...it's a old grey 30 amp box. Can't really see if its busted from what I can tell.

Anyway, decided to stick my light probe into the fuse box where it enters, and click, and the fans turn on. Seems that the line going back into the fuse wasn't pushed in far enough or had been pulled out a little at some point.

Much thanks to MM Racing, alocker, Loki, RichFiero, Dave13, and Michowski. ultimately the steps you told me to follow solved the problem and some headache for me.

I got the car on and heated up, and the was reading temps with an infrared gun the whole time. The fans kicked on right on cue. The car has not yet been on for that long of an extended period of time. Has always overheated.

Now I can FINALLY attempt to adjust the carb with the car running. Wish me luck!

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post #21 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-01-2011, 12:56 PM
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Swap it over to cross fire injection for more problems.
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post #22 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-01-2011, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
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Swap it over to cross fire injection for more problems.

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post #23 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-01-2011, 02:13 PM Thread Starter

 
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Shoot, I don't want to touch the thing. With these old cars, you touch one thing, and 2 other things break.

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post #24 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-01-2011, 07:16 PM
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Quote:
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Shoot, I don't want to touch the thing. With these old cars, you touch one thing, and 2 other things break.
Thats how you learn to work on them. Im curious on the specs of the car. What's in it? Make sure you check the timing also, that can cause it to run hot.

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