Woman fighting RLC ticket. - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 10:13 AM Thread Starter
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Woman fighting RLC ticket.

I got a kick out of this story last night.

I hope she gets more publicity.

Quote:
Woman Claims Cop Ran Red Light in Her Car

Updated: Wednesday, 09 Nov 2011, 10:01 PM CST
Published : Wednesday, 09 Nov 2011, 8:33 PM CST

By Craig Wall, FOX Chicago News



Chicago - A red light camera ticket has a suburban woman incredibly frustrated.

The red light violation happened at 3:03 a.m. on July 5 at 95th and Stoney Island.

Lottie Williams, of Dolton, had loaned her car to her brother that night and he got arrested at 95th and Jeffery, about an hour earlier, at 2:17 a.m., according to the police report.

So when Williams got the ticket, she appealed, presenting her evidence to an city administrative law judge only to have that appeal rejected.

"The administrative judge Kyra Paine told me oh, no it's not possible that the police department would have driven your car from the scene of the crime to the police department," Williams said. "Your sister or brother must have given permission for someone else to drive the car."

What the judge ignored was the fact that they were both arrested, and police had to maintain custody of the vehicle for evidence. So police were the only ones who could have driven the vehicle from 95th and Jeffery to the police department on 111th Street.

Williams believes it had to have been one of the officers listed on the impound form, Pearson or Carroll, beat 406 F, who were behind the wheel. But Williams says the law judge wasn't interested in that information.

"I really get a feeling that her job there is to make sure that we pay these tickets no matter what," Williams said.

Williams says when she went to the district for help, a sergeant basically called it her problem.

"The staff sergeant actually told me, 'Well, if your sister and brother hand't committed a crime, we wouldn't have been on the scene. No way any of this would have happened. So you're just out of luck,'" she said.

The video of the incident is no longer available on the Department of Revenue's website, but Williams said it showed her 1995 Bonneville slowing and then rolling through a right turn on red. She said she is not done fighting this.

I reached out to the Department of Revenue and Chicago Police, but no one returned my calls. A Law Department spokesman said with the evidence Williams had, this should have been a "slam dunk" to get the ticket dismissed.

Williams says it may cost her more to file a civil suit, but she will do it on principle.
http://www.myfoxchicago.com/dpp/news...liams-20111109

Cliff notes:
She lends car to family member. Family member gets arrested. Cop drives car to impound, and rolls a red light en route. She receives ticket. Courtroom Judge tells her to pay up.

Sorry that was more than 3 sentences.

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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 10:16 AM
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Strange that the car was not towed instead of being driven.

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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsd656 View Post
Strange that the car was not towed instead of being driven.
I don't know about you but given the chance I wouldn't pass up cruising in a '95 Bonneville.

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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 10:23 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsd656 View Post
Strange that the car was not towed instead of being driven.
I"m also puzzled by that. I thought that was procedure to tow, to remove department responsiblity.

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 10:26 AM
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It probably is, and thus the judge and SS are protecting the officer's poor judgement by telling the woman to just pay up.

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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 10:31 AM
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I bet they sped through a school zone on the way too, but that ticket's still in the mail.

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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadrach View Post
It probably is, and thus the judge and SS are protecting the officer's poor judgement by telling the woman to just pay up.
you are probably right. Please keep in mind that is not a great neighborhood and at 2AM leaving a car on the street could spell trouble. Also, being that the vehicle wasn't blocking traffic, its possible that the tow truck's response was not what the police officer wanted to wait for. I don't know what responsibility the officer has to property in an arrest situation, but if the tow truck driver is 2~3 hours away from the call, and the car is vandalized who is responsible?

What is illustrated here is that the State doesn't have to show burden of proof. That you are presumed guilty until you prove you are innocent. The video (evidence) that the state is responsible for has been destroyed. On these grounds wouldn't that call for a dismissal of the case?

Maybe I don't understand our basic rights as citizens of this country.

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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:19 AM
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The better indicator of corruption will be when she gets the bill from the towing company for the tow that never happened.

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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clearwaterms View Post
you are probably right. Please keep in mind that is not a great neighborhood and at 2AM leaving a car on the street could spell trouble. Also, being that the vehicle wasn't blocking traffic, its possible that the tow truck's response was not what the police officer wanted to wait for. I don't know what responsibility the officer has to property in an arrest situation, but if the tow truck driver is 2~3 hours away from the call, and the car is vandalized who is responsible?

What is illustrated here is that the State doesn't have to show burden of proof. That you are presumed guilty until you prove you are innocent. The video (evidence) that the state is responsible for has been destroyed. On these grounds wouldn't that call for a dismissal of the case?

Maybe I don't understand our basic rights as citizens of this country.
Since the ticket received was not a state violation, but a city one, the hearing was before an administrative judge. The rules in at administrative hearings are not the same as in a state or federal court so the "judge" covered up for the police.

If the car was not being used for evidence by the police in a criminal case, they just would have left it there as they would not care and would not be liable for any vandalism that would have occured to it. But since it was part of evidence, they needed to impound it. If the two alleged criminals get a decent attorney, they can probably use it to their advantage in court that the cop drove the car instead of it being towed. However, the owner of the car is screwed, unless she pursues the appeal process for the administrative hearings.

I am sure we do not know all the facts, but from what was presented, sucks for the owner of the vehicle, as she is being thrown under the bus by the city.

Greg

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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kegger View Post
The better indicator of corruption will be when she gets the bill from the towing company for the tow that never happened.

Greg

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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by clearwaterms View Post
Maybe I don't understand our basic rights as citizens of this country.
this was in chicago, the same rules that the nation has chicago doesn't have to abide by.

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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by FiReBReTHa View Post
this was in chicago, you have no rights.
fixerated

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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsd656 View Post
Since the ticket received was not a state violation, but a city one, the hearing was before an administrative judge. The rules in at administrative hearings are not the same as in a state or federal court so the "judge" covered up for the police.

If the car was not being used for evidence by the police in a criminal case, they just would have left it there as they would not care and would not be liable for any vandalism that would have occured to it. But since it was part of evidence, they needed to impound it. If the two alleged criminals get a decent attorney, they can probably use it to their advantage in court that the cop drove the car instead of it being towed. However, the owner of the car is screwed, unless she pursues the appeal process for the administrative hearings.

I am sure we do not know all the facts, but from what was presented, sucks for the owner of the vehicle, as she is being thrown under the bus by the city.
I think if nothing else this proves that the city is out for the revenue of the red light cameras and not the safety of it all. They could easily drop the charges due to some bland excuse that doesn't point the finger at the police officer. Instead they will stick to the story, and this lady did the right thing and the media getting involved is helping.

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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by pilotx1 View Post
fixerated
+1

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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clearwaterms View Post
I think if nothing else this proves that the city is out for the revenue of the red light cameras and not the safety of it all. They could easily drop the charges due to some bland excuse that doesn't point the finger at the police officer. Instead they will stick to the story, and this lady did the right thing and the media getting involved is helping.
Agree

Greg

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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 12:00 PM
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This really isnt a laughing matter
I cant imagine how furious I would be if I were in her position. I'd be afraid of going postal

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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 02:40 PM
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This really isnt a laughing matter
I cant imagine how furious I would be if I were in her position. I'd be afraid of going postal
+1. This is really f*cked ,up, but I would say it is par for how crooked the City as is and their "justice system."

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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by gsd656 View Post
Strange that the car was not towed instead of being driven.
Police officers would often drive the car to be towed/impounded to the police parking lot so that the offender's family (who has access to an extra set of keys) would not drive off. At the station the officer would then order a tow. It takes about an hour for the police tow to arrive on scene. The officer doesn't want to wait on scene for an hour when they can be at Dunkin Donuts.

Also sometimes police may want to search, I mean inventory, the car. It's easier to do that in the privacy of the police lot than in the streets with prying eyes.
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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 05:53 PM
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Something doesn't add up... ok, so the red light camera video is gone. What about the picture that comes in the mail with the ticket? No mention of the in-dash camera in the squad car either? It would've been parked behind the pulled over vehicle, and it would record either the squad car pulling out without the second officer getting back in the squad car, or the second officer starting and driving off with the vehicle...
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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by bwa View Post
Something doesn't add up... ok, so the red light camera video is gone. What about the picture that comes in the mail with the ticket? No mention of the in-dash camera in the squad car either? It would've been parked behind the pulled over vehicle, and it would record either the squad car pulling out without the second officer getting back in the squad car, or the second officer starting and driving off with the vehicle...
The in-dash camera doesn't record all the time. Only when the emergency lights are activated. It can be turned on/off manually by the officer. Most officer don't like their traffic stop being recorded, hence...
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post #21 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 07:08 PM
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post #22 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-10-2011, 07:36 PM
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