Groupon as a successful IPO - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 10:56 AM Thread Starter
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Groupon as a successful IPO

Having been burned by the initial dot-com crash of 1999, investment-wise and watching Groupon very closely, I'm interested to know other people's opinion on investing in Groupon (buying their stock) OR using Groupon as a business owner.

As a consumer, its a nice deal to get 50% or more off on certain products and services. But as a long term business marketing option, is Groupon really all that for business owners and investors?

One article that is influencing my viewpoint is this:
Groupon And Cocainel.
Which concludes:
"Many small businesses today are desperately looking for an easy replacement to the Yellow Pages. So they have jumped on Groupon as the Holy Grail. I’m sorry to tell you, but Groupon isn’t the messiah as the hype promises. To me it looks more like coupons in sheep’s clothing. Coupons don’t build a brand, they destroy it."

My investments are in companies with profitability and cash-flow. And I thought Groupon should have accepted Google's multi-billion dollar offer, but am interested in your views on this.

Have at it.

Last edited by crashomon; 12-08-2011 at 11:08 AM.
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post #2 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:14 AM
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I wouldn't buy. It's going to be a bust, the company hasn't made any money and has shown sketchy accounting practices. It'll be another Pandora.

I agree with you, they should have accepted Google's offer.

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post #3 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:17 AM
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I would stay away from the stock as well, unless you are doing a short term investment and will cash out quickly before the hype goes away.

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post #4 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:20 AM
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Another +1 for should've sold out to Google. Google has their own version now and they are throwing their deep pockets at advertising in earnest now.
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post #5 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:36 AM
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They fucked up BIG TIME - Take the fuckin $ and run you stupid fucks - $6B with basically ZERO start up from them? - They even made their landlord part owner in the Co as they were behind on back rent - Yes, out of the gate they looked GREAT on the Street but are now a BS stock - Will be watching to see where they are this time next year when MS comes in and buys them for $3M

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post #6 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:37 AM
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i don't think they sold to google because they new their accounting practices would kill the deal.
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post #7 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dennywags View Post
i don't think they sold to google because they new their accounting practices would kill the deal.
So maybe taking it from $6B to say $4B? - They did have some shady dealing but c'mon ladies, you start a Co with nothing and a GIANT like Google throws BILLIONS at you and you say "No"? - Does not take an MBA from Harvard to know that something is fishy there

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post #8 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:43 AM
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Groupon = Good for us consumers
Groupon = Bad for us investors

Don't bother.
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post #9 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashomon View Post
I thought Groupon should have accepted Google's multi-billion dollar offer, but am interested in your views on this.

Have at it.
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Originally Posted by Chills View Post

I agree with you, they should have accepted Google's offer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by suh-c View Post
Another +1 for should've sold out to Google. Google has their own version now and they are throwing their deep pockets at advertising in earnest now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug View Post
So maybe taking it from $6B to say $4B? - They did have some shady dealing but c'mon ladies, you start a Co with nothing and a GIANT like Google throws BILLIONS at you and you say "No"? - Does not take an MBA from Harvard to know that something is fishy there

No shit they should have cashed out when they were the only game in town. I understand not wanting to give up your baby...but damn. Billions in pocket, go make something new.

Now you have massive competition. Google, LivingSocial, CBS Local offers. Probably 2 dozen smaller ones I don't know about.

And yes, its just fancy fucking coupons.

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post #10 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 12:14 PM
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I am not a business owner, but I have heard a lot of business owners explain about groupon.
For example- Lets say you own a car wash, detail center. You are offering a $100 detail job for half off, so that's $50. Then groupon actually gets half of the deal, $25. So you are only making $25, but that's not all. Most of the time you get cheap fucks who want something for nothing and everyone will wait until a Saturday to come in. Then they will get pissed for the business getting backed up and taking so long or not doing that good of job because they have so many cars. They also may only have 1 or 2 repeat customers out of 50 because most people are cheap asses and looking for stuff for free.
If you want to get a deal and still have the business keep most the profit, I would call them and ask if you can get the deal so that they make more money.
I know a lot of business owners that say they regret doing groupon. Also, those people will go online and leave negative feedback all over the internet about you.
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post #11 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 12:16 PM

 
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My take....not a good investment.

Here's why.

Barriers of entry are too low. Entering the coupon/discount offer service space is too easy for the competition. Add in conglomerates like Google and Apple who are toying with entering the industry...and you're toast. They have the resources to enter quickly and successfully, and do it better than most.

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post #12 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 12:17 PM
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Groupon is about $20/share? Not ridiculously expensive and hell you just never know. Yes it's bad and yes it could possibly be good.

I'm sure no one was buying Apple stock when it was almost delisted from NASDAQ LOL
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post #13 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdgenTa View Post
I am not a business owner, but I have heard a lot of business owners explain about groupon.
For example- Lets say you own a car wash, detail center. You are offering a $100 detail job for half off, so that's $50. Then groupon actually gets half of the deal, $25. So you are only making $25, but that's not all. Most of the time you get cheap fucks who want something for nothing and everyone will wait until a Saturday to come in. Then they will get pissed for the business getting backed up and taking so long or not doing that good of job because they have so many cars. They also may only have 1 or 2 repeat customers out of 50 because most people are cheap asses and looking for stuff for free.
If you want to get a deal and still have the business keep most the profit, I would call them and ask if you can get the deal so that they make more money.
I know a lot of business owners that say they regret doing groupon. Also, those people will go online and leave negative feedback all over the internet about you.

that's why a lot of them state times/dates when the offer is valid.

If you run a car wash when should you expect most ppl tom use your service? Probably when they are not at work...when is that? If that is going to be a problem either bring on more staff during a busy period, or specify that its only good on weekdays or weekends before noon.

If they are going to be that thick they kind of get what they deserve.

I think a groupon type service COULD be used as an effective marketing too, if the business owner approaches it in the correct way. It certainly gets your product out to a large audience of which many probably would have otherwise never heard of you.

On the consumer side I am signed up to a bunch of these email list discount coupon things. I barely buy anything from the offeres but I do get to familiarize myself with a lot of businesses and products I would otherwise not be exposed. I've gone to or bought from a lot of places that have had a groupon offer simply because I had heard of them and found a lot of good reviews even though I didn't buy the groupon for one reason or another.

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post #14 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 12:55 PM
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Run away fast. I've seen their 'office'. They should have taken the $4billion.

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post #15 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdgenTa View Post
I am not a business owner, but I have heard a lot of business owners explain about groupon.
For example- Lets say you own a car wash, detail center. You are offering a $100 detail job for half off, so that's $50. Then groupon actually gets half of the deal, $25. So you are only making $25, but that's not all. Most of the time you get cheap fucks who want something for nothing and everyone will wait until a Saturday to come in. Then they will get pissed for the business getting backed up and taking so long or not doing that good of job because they have so many cars. They also may only have 1 or 2 repeat customers out of 50 because most people are cheap asses and looking for stuff for free.
If you want to get a deal and still have the business keep most the profit, I would call them and ask if you can get the deal so that they make more money.
I know a lot of business owners that say they regret doing groupon. Also, those people will go online and leave negative feedback all over the internet about you.
Bingo. On multiple occasions we've waited to literally the last weekend to use a resturant.com or Groupon coupon at a restaurant and you'll see every 3rd table paying with one. The reason these blew-up in popularity was that no one was eating out for years since the economy went in the toilet so these helped struggling restaurants. But since thinkgs have picked back up and people are eating out much more again less establishments are using these anymore.

Groupon rode the top of that wave, but I think they held out too long and should have cashed out when tey had the chance.

Smarter small businesses are paying attention to things like Yelp and Facebook as a (free!) advertising portal.

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post #16 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 01:17 PM
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4B would buy a lot of hookers, blow, and sumos. I would have sold.
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post #17 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug View Post
So maybe taking it from $6B to say $4B? - They did have some shady dealing but c'mon ladies, you start a Co with nothing and a GIANT like Google throws BILLIONS at you and you say "No"? - Does not take an MBA from Harvard to know that something is fishy there
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bek View Post
Groupon = Good for us consumers
Groupon = Bad for us investors

Don't bother.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdgenTa View Post
I am not a business owner, but I have heard a lot of business owners explain about groupon.
For example- Lets say you own a car wash, detail center. You are offering a $100 detail job for half off, so that's $50. Then groupon actually gets half of the deal, $25. So you are only making $25, but that's not all. Most of the time you get cheap fucks who want something for nothing and everyone will wait until a Saturday to come in. Then they will get pissed for the business getting backed up and taking so long or not doing that good of job because they have so many cars. They also may only have 1 or 2 repeat customers out of 50 because most people are cheap asses and looking for stuff for free.
If you want to get a deal and still have the business keep most the profit, I would call them and ask if you can get the deal so that they make more money.
I know a lot of business owners that say they regret doing groupon. Also, those people will go online and leave negative feedback all over the internet about you.
+1 I have heard it's not great for the businesses involved, but if you are just looking for turnover/cash flow right now, or some cheap advertising, then it might help.
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post #18 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 01:42 PM
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+1 I have heard it's not great for the businesses involved, but if you are just looking for turnover/cash flow right now, or some cheap advertising, then it might help.
That being said when and what will the CP Groupon be?
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post #19 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 02:09 PM
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I already thought of that, but really, this sport is already filled with cheap fuckers, so it would have to be a crack smoking deal for anybody to buy, and for SURE be a loss to the business. I thought about tire changes, but nobody wants to pay for them now, and even then they would have to be $15 each or something stupid for it to even make sense and get any volume. Not worth it. Somewhere above it was said basically, that it was the beginning of the end for Groupon participants.
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post #20 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug View Post
So maybe taking it from $6B to say $4B? - They did have some shady dealing but c'mon ladies, you start a Co with nothing and a GIANT like Google throws BILLIONS at you and you say "No"? - Does not take an MBA from Harvard to know that something is fishy there
that's my point. groupon didn't want the truth to come out. because i would have taken the cash.
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post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 02:31 PM
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MPGP seems to like doing Groupons! LOL
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post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 03:00 PM
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MPGP seems to like doing Groupons! LOL
Groupons could be good for a business when in additional to the "special" you have the customer by the balls and you can ensure with a certain level of certainty that the customer will spend additional money on their visit or will become a repeat customer.

Place like MPGP will get you with booze sales and the addictive factor.

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post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
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MPGP seems to like doing Groupons! LOL
Mt Prospect Grand Prix?

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post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 03:21 PM
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post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 03:53 PM
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I'll address Groupon from the business standpoint. I looked at them for Car TLC for oil changes.

Let's use a $40 deal for example. It gets discounted to $20 for the Groupon...Groupon takes half of that and you get $10. But not so fast...there is also another 2.5% fee for them processing the credit cards which knocks your take home down to $7.50 for a $40 regular sale. What sucks is you get 1/3 payment 7 days after the Groupon...the next 1/3..... 60 days later and the final 1/3...90 days later. If people cash them in sooner they will pay faster.

Restaurants and salons use Groupon a lot...it kills there business because you get the groupon chasers and they won't spend anymore money, tie up regular paying customers and trash you in reviews. I had friends in Phoenix that used it in their restaurant and hated it...only 25% return customers and trashed them in reviews online because they caught them trying to use coupons twice, etc.


I, on the other hand believe it would be great for me. I'll use them in the spring for Car TLC. We have a different business though....a new concept of servicing vehicles that people aren't familiar with and once people use our service they LOVE IT and stick with us as customers. I also get the upsells...your car needs stuff....I get the upsells of tire rotations, wiper blades, air/cabin filters etc. Our main goal is get new customers as fast as possible because they stick with us. Your vehicle has to be serviced...you don't have to buy extra food when at a restaurant.

I just did a Try It Local...an offshoot of Groupon. I sold 90 coupons and limited it to 2 per person.....exactly 2/3 of the people bought 1 and 1/3 bought 2 coupons. What's nice with TIL...is you get to keep 68% of the funds paid out 100% a week later and it's run through each Chamber of Commerce in the cities they are in.

In 2 weeks since running the special I've serviced 25 people out of 64 new customers. 50% of them I've had upsells in service and I've also added 5 new customers on top of that from their friends or co-workers. So far it's been a great investment. Everyone in the Try it Local office bought a coupon and I've serviced 1/2 of them so far....they love our concept and actually handle Try it Local nationwide from down here. Out of the 64 customers that purchased...only 1 was a current customer of ours.

I didn't want to do a Groupon because at most I could only handle 400 coupons by myself. 10-15% are cashed in the first 2 weeks and then 10-15% the last 2 weeks before expiration...it drops for the weeks in between.

I'll do a Groupon in the spring when we have other employees and can handle 1,200+ Groupon coupons. I just need the new customers....but you don't want to run a Groupon twice a year because you will just get your current customers buying them...not effective. Big O Tires did a Groupon and sold 2,600 coupons, which is what they set the maximum number at...wow.

To give you an idea....Louisville has 1.2million people...300,000 get groupon....Try it Local has 35,000.

I think it really comes down to your type of business....if you just want to get your name out there, are new and not in the restaurant or salon business and are doing something unique like us...I think it's great. The goal is to try and break even on the cost of the service.....then it's a great way to reach a lot of people with no out of pocket expense other than your time in labor.

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post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 04:10 PM
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Should have sold out to google. Coupon companies arent anything new.

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post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 05:50 PM
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Salon workers hate it because they get screwed on the tips.

If your regular haircut is $150 and do a Groupon for $75....most people are cheap and only tip on the $75....thus the stylists are making 1/2 the money they would have.

Also, if they sell a ton of Groupons....the salon is booked up with 1/2 paying new customers and the regulars have a hard time scheduling in their appointments and get pissed off and go elsewhere.

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post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 05:53 PM
BSB > WSBK > MotoGP
 
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I also tip at full price regardless of what a coupon was for. Cutting the server's tip for your coupon is a cheap-ass move.

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post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 06:07 PM
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groupon is ghey

never looked into it, but thats my feeling.



use coupons that come in the paper.
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post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 12-08-2011, 07:09 PM
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Location: Plainfield IL
Sportbike: A couple of pasta rockets
Years Riding: Since 1989
How you found us: In the beginning there was CLSB and Tony saw that it was good.
           
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Safety first is spot on. I did some group on type stuff. its good for getting your name out there, but you won't make any money at all.




HDTony.... Damn glad to meet you!

Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

- Ronald Reagan

AirTek Heating & Air inc.
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