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post #1 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:16 PM Thread Starter
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Gun Control

Lot of discussions going on about how to address such shootings.

What would you propose to help stop such acts?

Tighter gun control laws?
Arm teachers?
Increase armed security in all schools?

You better be nice to America or we will bring democracy to your country.
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post #2 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:22 PM
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Arm teachers! But its not possible to stop ppl from killing mass ppl. Timothy McVeigh killed hundreds, with fertilizer and diesel.

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post #3 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:23 PM
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post #4 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:46 PM
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Do you think that the fact that schools and College campuses etc. are declared and posted as "GUN FREE" zones might have something to do with the fact that they have become targets for violently unbalanced people?
Arming teachers may not be viable but, how about some armed security? What an opportunity for a retired cop!
Guns are not the problem they are being made out to be in this situation...Yesterday as the events in Newtown were unfolding, on the other side of the world 22 children and one adult were viciously stabbed in an attck in a Chinese school! Unbalanced people bent on perpetrating evil will find a way. It's not only people with guns!

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post #5 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:48 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldTimeBiker View Post
Do you think that the fact that schools and College campuses etc. are declared and posted as "GUN FREE" zones might have something to do with the fact that they have become targets for violently unbalanced people?
Arming teachers may not be viable but, how about some armed security? What an opportunity for a retired cop!
Guns are not the problem they are being made out to be in this situation...Yesterday as the events in Newtown were unfolding, on the other side of the world 22 children and one adult were viciously stabbed in an attck in a Chinese school! Unbalanced people bent on perpetrating evil will find a way. It's not only people with guns!
Yesterday I heard an interesting point that cases like this tend to happen during bad economic times.

I'm not old enough to make a comment on this, but I wonder if its true...

You better be nice to America or we will bring democracy to your country.
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post #6 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Gone In 3 View Post
Yesterday I heard an interesting point that cases like this tend to happen during bad economic times.

I'm not old enough to make a comment on this, but I wonder if its true...
Bad times test people . Some move on while others inflict pain.

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post #7 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 02:56 PM
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Huge discussion on the WERA board about this, covering Gun law, mental health, and media.

IMO, there are a lot of contributory factors to these mass killings. Guns and gun policy are only a small part of what needs to be evaluated, and if guns weren't available, then other means of mass killing would be employed instead.

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post #8 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 03:45 PM
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http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/15/world/...html?hpt=hp_c2

Interesting article.

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post #9 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 03:57 PM
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As Cerk posted in the other thread and I've discussed with a few last night: the conversation should be on mental health awareness, treatment and related laws. Talking about guns and physical prevention of tragedies like this is like trying to put out a building on fire with your piss after drinking grain alcohol.

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post #10 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blade Runner View Post
this

"I don't think we should limit the free press ... but people are watching this, they are learning from these kind of attacks. They are becoming more and more organized, better planned -- and that is horrible.

Join the NRA, help protect our Second Amendment rights
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post #11 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:12 PM
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I think there is need for more security in schools. Also need to stop blaming guns as the issue. These people are going to get a weapon one way or another. Certain drugs are illegal and people who use get them all the time. More gun control just means more illegal guns. There are nuts out there more so than years ago. I think the media feeds these nuts some too. Repeat crimes because of so much coverage of these stories makes these guys think it is ok in their crazy mind. I have a two yr old and just cant imagine what those families are going through.
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post #12 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:26 PM
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The tighter gun laws are the easier they are to get. That's what people don't understand.
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post #13 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:41 PM
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This thread is a TRAP. Gone in 3 will tell what the citizens defenses are to his muslim buddies.
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post #14 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth View Post
The tighter gun laws are the easier they are to get. That's what people don't understand.
But the thing is, those anti-gunners see it as banning all guns, except in the hands of police and military. These anti-gunners, don't own guns, they don't care nor understand that there are over 200 MILLION guns in the US. They see it as perfectly acceptable to round up every privately owned weapon, be it a pistol, hunting/sport long gun, or "assault rifle" and grind them into rebar. Because if they did that, school shootings wouldn't happen "THINK OF THE CHILDREN!"

It's OK that muggings and gang violence will go up...because only scum and people who are too stupid to move out of shitty neighborhoods will be effected...not those with big houses, high fences, and private security. They see it as the bad element killing off the bad element and that simply doesn't affect them.

What they don't see a shop owner protecting himself and his son when 3 thugs break in waving around a gun they for some reason didn't turn in! Or the 20 something walking home from campus after a night class, about to be raped...well, she could use pepper spray! Besides, she should be in the kitchen, right? Or if someone from the ghetto decides to go shopping in the suburban houses...just let them take your shit...they'll leave you alone if you don't put up a fight! A TV isn't worth your life!

People who haven't had to face violence can't understand the need for violence, even to protect themselves.

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post #15 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:49 PM
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But the thing is, those anti-gunners see it as banning all guns, except in the hands of police and military. These anti-gunners, don't own guns, they don't care nor understand that there are over 200 MILLION guns in the US. They see it as perfectly acceptable to round up every privately owned weapon, be it a pistol, hunting/sport long gun, or "assault rifle" and grind them into rebar. Because if they did that, school shootings wouldn't happen "THINK OF THE CHILDREN!"

It's OK that muggings and gang violence will go up...because only scum and people who are too stupid to move out of shitty neighborhoods will be effected...not those with big houses, high fences, and private security. They see it as the bad element killing off the bad element.

What they don't see a shop owner protecting himself and his son when 3 thugs break in waving around a gun they for some reason didn't turn in! Or the 20 something walking home from campus after a night class, about to be raped...well, she could use pepper spray! Besides, she should be in the kitchen, right? Or if someone from the ghetto decides to go shopping in the suburban houses...just let them take your shit...they'll leave you alone if you don't put up a fight! A TV isn't worth your life!

People who haven't had to face violence can't understand the need for violence, even to protect themselves.
When we moved to IL , someone told me pepper spray is illegal here. WTF !?

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post #16 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:56 PM
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When we moved to IL , someone told me pepper spray is illegal here. WTF !?
There were issues with people using pepper spray in clubs and on trains and shit...it could have even been in back in the '80s. I think the bans on those types of products have backed off a little bit. I've not looked into it in years.

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post #17 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 04:57 PM
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ILLINOIS: Legal with restrictions.

The use of a product "**containing a non-lethal noxious liquid gas or substance designed solely for personal defense carried by a person 18 years of age or older" is authorized by Section 720 ILCS 5/24-1.

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post #18 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
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ILLINOIS: Legal with restrictions.

The use of a product "**containing a non-lethal noxious liquid gas or substance designed solely for personal defense carried by a person 18 years of age or older" is authorized by Section 720 ILCS 5/24-1.
Thanks for the clarification.

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post #19 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 05:39 PM
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post #20 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 06:07 PM
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We should just ban Murder... Nevermind. That wont work

People have been slaughtering each other, including kids, since the begining of time. It's not new. And, there's no legislation that'll stop it.

Firearms, bombs, knives, fire, poison, rape, rocks, sticks, fists, airplanes, etc.
The weapon doesn't matter. Killing is in our nature

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post #21 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 06:27 PM
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I equate all this "Gun Control" to having about as much "power" as Reagan back in the '80s with his War on Drugs - Everyone has ideas on how to approach and contain but in the end, the gun (or the drugs) is not the problem - It is "Human" thing - As others have said, it is not about the gun, it is the person - Evil exists and always will - Be it a gun, a staff, a blade or a bomb - If the subject is motivated enough, the task will get carried out

Go watch the Movie "Traffic" or read up on the Coke Turf Wars of Miami in the '80s - Substitiute Drugs for Guns - It is all the same .........and it is a fact of life and that of a sad one

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post #22 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 06:45 PM
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This isn't a new phenomenon. Look up the Bath Massacre from Michigan. It's just more publicized now.
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post #23 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 06:48 PM
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I'm still out on the whole conceal carry, I know a lot of people who are for it. After watching nutnfancys conceal carry protocol, I would not want to live with a gun on me all the time. I'm not a true gun guy so I'm not sure what people in the industry think of this guy but I watched out tho see a different point if view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLN6...e_gdata_player
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post #24 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-15-2012, 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonely Raven View Post
But the thing is, those anti-gunners see it as banning all guns, except in the hands of police and military. These anti-gunners, don't own guns, they don't care nor understand that there are over 200 MILLION guns in the US. They see it as perfectly acceptable to round up every privately owned weapon, be it a pistol, hunting/sport long gun, or "assault rifle" and grind them into rebar. Because if they did that, school shootings wouldn't happen "THINK OF THE CHILDREN!"

It's OK that muggings and gang violence will go up...because only scum and people who are too stupid to move out of shitty neighborhoods will be effected...not those with big houses, high fences, and private security. They see it as the bad element killing off the bad element and that simply doesn't affect them.

What they don't see a shop owner protecting himself and his son when 3 thugs break in waving around a gun they for some reason didn't turn in! Or the 20 something walking home from campus after a night class, about to be raped...well, she could use pepper spray! Besides, she should be in the kitchen, right? Or if someone from the ghetto decides to go shopping in the suburban houses...just let them take your shit...they'll leave you alone if you don't put up a fight! A TV isn't worth your life!

People who haven't had to face violence can't understand the need for violence, even to protect themselves.
Well said.

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post #25 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 01:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtbiker View Post
This isn't a new phenomenon. Look up the Bath Massacre from Michigan. It's just more publicized now.
History tends to repeat .

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post #26 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 03:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtbiker View Post
This isn't a new phenomenon. Look up the Bath Massacre from Michigan. It's just more publicized now.
Interesting last name. Distant relative or no relation?

I won't say who but I imagine many on here know who. Up to him to say any more.
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post #27 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 03:44 AM
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Interesting last name. Distant relative or no relation?

I won't say who but I imagine many on here know who. Up to him to say any more.

no relation whatsoever that im aware of, and if there is ive never heard of them

its a common last name, theres even another family here in eg same name no relation

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post #28 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 07:07 AM
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Penn states it as simple as possible. His thoughts on the second amendment.

http://youtu.be/MATTUiz2TKc

On "gun free zones".

http://youtu.be/gLr-oZWPXVc

The entire episode if you are interested.

http://youtu.be/0XrNzE39J8E

I have the right to carry a firearm, and want to continue to have the right to choose shoot/don't shoot in any situation that required me to draw my weapon.

"Gun free zones" are seen as easy pickings for a criminal. A few teachers are heros for saving the lives of their students by quick thinking and giving up their own lives. I wish the teacher was allowed to be armed and save her own life, and more of the students that were killed that day.

Last edited by Dave13; 12-16-2012 at 07:59 AM.
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post #29 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murcielago View Post
I'm still out on the whole conceal carry, I know a lot of people who are for it. After watching nutnfancys conceal carry protocol, I would not want to live with a gun on me all the time. I'm not a true gun guy so I'm not sure what people in the industry think of this guy but I watched out tho see a different point if view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLN6...e_gdata_player
The biggest problem with these videos are the people involved have little to no education on what to do in a defensive situation. Why the woman stood up to shoot is confusing. I'm thinking she stands at the range, and that is what she is has in her head. Take a knee, use that table for something to steady yourself on, and shot placement will increase dramatically, as well as your own safety is increased as you are a smaller target.

The one where the guy investigates a noise is another poor choice. If you hear a noise, lock yourself in your room, get your weapon handy, and call 911. Shoot only if that door comes busting in from the bad guy.
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post #30 of 1029 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 12:46 PM
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Be prepared to deal with evil people or be prepared to deal with the impact of evil people.

It's that simple. People bent on murdering do not care what laws or regulations stipulate while making their plans.

Schools need to arm themselves...whether that's with police officers or private security or something else is up to others, but you can't bring safety protocol to a gun fight.

People need to face facts...and take a new look at mental health as well.

Tom

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