Riders blamed for accident - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:35 AM Thread Starter
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Riders blamed for accident

Here is an interisting article

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/Midwest/0....ap/index.html
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post #2 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:37 AM
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moral of this read: wear your seatbelt
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post #3 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:40 AM
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oh boy, here comes the drama, Keep it to a minumum guys, I'm not having a repeat of yesterday. Today I am banning people.




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post #4 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:43 AM
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Just be carefull out there guys. with things like this happening sportbikes are going to be targeted big time.

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post #5 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:50 AM
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" Safety advocates are quick to point out that motorcycling is no game, with fatalities nationwide having risen every year since 1997. The number jumped from 2,116 in 1997 to 3,661 in 2003 "

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post #6 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by HDTony
oh boy, here comes the drama, Keep it to a minumum guys, I'm not having a repeat of yesterday. Today I am banning people.
ohohoh....what did I miss yesterday?

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post #7 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by shadrach
ohohoh....what did I miss yesterday?
Dont worry about it. Stunter verses antistunter drama is over and will not fire up again.





The ban button is feeling a bit rusty and needs to be exercised




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post #8 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:00 AM
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was it something I said?

It was a unforutnate that the car crashed because of bikers. I am not ignoring the fact bikers are at fault, but mean while, I can't stand people who don't wear seatbelt
quote from the news: "The Suburban tumbled down an embankment, ejecting most of its eight occupants. Five people in that vehicle were seriously injured; the other three sustained lesser harm. Only one was wearing a seat belt"
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post #9 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:04 AM
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Um... I don't wish harm on anyone just like everyone else here (I think), but in Drivers Ed, I think they teach you to never swerve out of the way. Always stay in your lane and grab the hooks hard. This is the same for other vehicles or wildlife critters or anything. If you are cut off by a band of "extreme motorcyclists" I think it would best be taken care of by braking and not swerving. (Plus you're in an SUV for cryin' out loud!)

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post #10 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by chuckie
Just be carefull out there guys. with things like this happening sportbikes are going to be targeted big time.
You speak the truth Chuckie!

The most dangerous/reckless vehicle on the streets is a SUV with a woman behind the wheel talking on her cell phone.
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post #11 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:22 AM
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Yeah, if there was no contact between the bike and the SUV, there's no liability.
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post #12 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:25 AM
 
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couldnt this easily be turned into how unsafe surburbans and SUVs are? yes there were extreme motorcyclists involved. But the dumb ass driver of an SUV decides to swerve at highway speeds? Regardless if it was a motorcycle or not, a stunter or not, or a fast and the furious type car or not, the driver swerved violently in a car that has a high center of gravity. I would say that is driver error.

Has that driver never been cut off before? I highly doubt it. No need to blame a rider for this one. There shouldnt have been any blame on a rider for this in my eyes. Stunter or not!

OH AND WEAR A DAMN SEAT BELT!!!!! This wouldnt have been an issue if people werent ejected from the vehicle.

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post #13 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by RevMatch1
Yeah, if there was no contact between the bike and the SUV, there's no liability.
Legally that is true, but I would not want that on my conscience.
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post #14 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:29 AM
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OK... let me get this straight..... They are going to blame motorcycle stunting as the cause of this crash when they say in the article that the cause was the fact that the SUV swerved when it was cut off?? Bull! Also, they say the fatalities were because none of the morons in the second SUV were strapped in!! Come on people, stop targeting sportbikes as the cause for all of the problems just because they were in the area. I'm not saying that the rider who cut the SUV short wasn't at fault, but saying that them stunting or speeding caused it is total crap.

-Sorry... off my rant now... I just think that SUV drivers in general are more dangerous then motorcycles are.

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post #15 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:29 AM
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Chuckie, I was thinking the same thing as I read the article. Those dumbasses in the SUV's weren't wearing their seatbelts and were thrown. Also, it was one lumbering SUV swerving into another one.

I'm not saying who is to be blamed, I wasn't there. It just sucks that ALL sport bike riders are likely to be targeted for the actions of a few.

But hell, that's how it always works, isn't it? The actions of a few screw it up for the majority.

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post #16 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:30 AM
 
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hehe, good thing I checked before posting a thread with that link. Interesting read. Last paragraph is probably true too without much exaggeration.
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post #17 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:32 AM
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Is it really our job to sit hear all high and mighty to assign blame all the time. Fuck the blame it was a tragic accident and people died, thats the end of the story.




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post #18 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:33 AM
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While the bikes were probably doing dumb stuff in traffic, that wasn't the cause of this "accident."
1. I highly doubt the MC hit the 1st SUV forcing it into the 2nd SUV.
2. The driver of SUV 1 got scared and swerved. Why would you swerve?
3. Don't all 50 states have a seatbelt law?
*sigh* Unfortunately I think Chuckie is right. Time to go Motard!

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post #19 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:36 AM
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Ok Im confused? Go figure.

Is it the bike that does the stunts or the individual rider?

Do all riders stunt in traffic?

Has the popularity of motorcycle riding increased?

If yes then by how much?

Do the accident stats match the percentage of the popularity of riding increase? ie more people riding = more potential accidents. Simple law of stats. I would guess percentage wise its not an increase. Now if there were 10000 riders in 2002 with 2000 accidents and 10000 riders in 2003 with 3000 accidents that I would say is an increase. But if there were 20000 riders and only 3000 accidents then percentages are reduced by 25% See what I mean. Yes 1 accident is too much.

Then they go on to make it sound like its the sportbike community that is the cause of the accidents. How about with the popularity of the sport increasing and all the newbs getting out there and not so experienced. Where do they factor in? What stats do they have as to the cause of the accidents? What type of bike is involved? You can chew up stats and these kind of reports all day long.

Long story short. The article is coming out and saying that sportbikes and their riders are dangerous and have no respect for the law. In the examples that they used I would agree and its a case of a bad apple ruining the pie. But as a blanket statment I strongly disagree.

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post #20 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:38 AM
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Indeed, this is a tragic accident. It's also a shame that this story will get a lot more publicity then say ...someone talking on thier cell phone and rear ending a motorcyclist. Even if the motorcyclist died, this "EVIL MOTORCYCLE GANG" story will be the one on the front page in the morning.

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post #21 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Champ91
Do the accident stats match the percentage of the popularity of riding increase?
Exactly! Does the media really think people are this stupid? Ehhh, nevermind alot of people are stupid enough to believe everything their TV tells them.

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post #22 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:45 AM
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We can assign all the blame we want and try to rationalize it in our minds. fact is the guys filming stunts was the catalyst.


if you take their activities out of the picture and they are just riding along normally, none of this ever happened.

Now I'm not sitting here flaming the stunters among us, just looking at it objectivly. either way the press will have a field day with it and theres nothing we can do about it but go out and try ot set a good example.




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post #23 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by chuckie
Just be carefull out there guys. with things like this happening sportbikes are going to be targeted big time.
Exactly, nobody likes us to begin with, then people pull this stuff. Pretty soon they'll start banning motorcycles altogether.

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post #24 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:46 AM
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Good point Tony. Ride safe out there

Ride smart... stupid hurts.

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Godspeed 788!!! We miss you!
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post #25 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by 6nickyfan9
Exactly, nobody likes us to begin with, then people pull this stuff. Pretty soon they'll start banning motorcycles altogether.

yup, everytime a few of these stories show up in the papers, you start to here rumblings about anti-bike legislation. Hopefully it will never come to banning bikes entirely, but I could see speed/engine limitations as a possibility. In fact, I'm surprised we don't see more lawsuits agains the major manufacturers, similar to the gun industry.
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post #26 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 10:57 AM Thread Starter
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There are many things we can say, to access the situation, and many of us will have different opinions. The fact stands that the media is hyping this out of context. The people in the car are trying to blame someone for there accident, although many things contributed to the accident. The media is expanding on what they want and trying to make it a readable article. It cought our attention and I am sure it is catching all the law enforcement officials, and motorists out there attention. They may target us more, but the truth stands, its' the medias fault, not ours, and the police are going to justify this my stopping us more and more, until we brake. If another car causes an accident it's normal, but when a bike is involved(accused of causing it) it's news. We have to be careful out there as time goes on, I am sure many of us have read about all the recent medias attention on sports bikes. As long as people read it they will say what they want, no matter who it affects....

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post #27 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by HDTony
Is it really our job to sit hear all high and mighty to assign blame all the time. Fuck the blame it was a tragic accident and people died, thats the end of the story.
Well put Tony. I was thinking the exact same thing. I know we are all entitled to our own opinions, but damn!, people (probably including kids) got seriously hurt here. If somebody close to you was in that SUV then it would be a different story, wouldn't it? And by the way, this is beginning to be deja vu all over again. If you read the "stunters on 53" thread in the gen. moto forum, this news clip is on there. This is what Tony meant when he mentioned he doesn't want a repeat and to keep the bashing to a minimum.

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post #28 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 11:09 AM
 
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Tony I totally agree with your post.

There are alot of people on the roads nowadays who really do not know how to properly control a motor vehicle and know how to handle emergency situations. One example is the whole Ford Explorer and Firestone tire fiasco. I watched a show where they stated that if the people driving those Explorers knew not to swerve and slam on the brakes, then the likelihood of a rollover would be greatly reduced. Although there was a problem with the tires...driver error caused the rollovers.

Our whole licensing system needs an overhaul and the requirements to obtain and maintain driving/riding privileges should be changed. Two examples are elderly drivers (need to be tested on an annual basis after age 65) and motorcycles (everyone who wants a license should have to pass a MSF type course). There is a long list of items that need to be addressed with automobile licenses, but the problem is that this will only add to the bureaucracy and politics won't let it happen anyway.
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post #29 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by P Funk


Our whole licensing system needs an overhaul and the requirements to obtain and maintain driving/riding privileges should be changed. Two examples are elderly drivers (need to be tested on an annual basis after age 65) and motorcycles (everyone who wants a license should have to pass a MSF type course). There is a long list of items that need to be addressed with automobile licenses, but the problem is that this will only add to the bureaucracy and politics won't let it happen anyway.
I seriuosly would like to see a graduated licensing system out there. theres no reason a new freshly licesnsed rider needs a busa. as well theres no reason a 16 year old kid needs a brand new cobra either. just plain scary




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post #30 of 54 (permalink) Old 08-25-2004, 11:21 AM
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Instead of arguing abou twhos fault it was we should be discussing what we can do as a group to minimize the chances of this happening when we are out riding. Learning from history is what makes us civilized people.




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Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

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