Rewarding Failure ***Rant*** - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:04 PM Thread Starter
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Rewarding Failure ***Rant***

So Chicago Public Schools in its boundless stupidity is letting all 8th graders graduate on stage regardless of test scores or grades.

This is a great way to empower kids with the wrong message.

They feel that having their parents sign a waiver that states they realize it is only a ceremony and they still must attend summer school is satisfactory.

Just a little pissed today.

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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:06 PM
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Thats retarded. If they fail, they don't go to graduation, end of story.

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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:12 PM
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What do you expect?

It is CPS after all.

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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:12 PM
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prolly do this cause if they didn't there would only be a handful of people at the cermony..

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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:17 PM
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I love how the parents actually complained because the failing kids couldn't attend graduation.
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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:19 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoparBoyy
prolly do this cause if they didn't there would only be a handful of people at the cermony..

Not with me only 7 out of 62 woould not make it.

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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:22 PM
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How about not spending the money on the ceremony for 8th grade and instead put it to use to help gets the kids up to snuff.

What next? A ceremony for everyone who took a shit and survived the toilet water back-splash?

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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:36 PM
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a few serious thoughts on this...

First off, I didn't graduate highschool on time. Through my first three years in highschool, I was a very good student, earning a 3.6 on a 4.0 scale taking all honors courses. I was a member of the national honor society, yada, yada, yada. My senior year, I was given the opportunity to leave school early (not take a 7th period) but was warned I had to pass all my classes in order to achieve enough credits to graduate. Like most seniors I slacked off and unfortinately didn't meat the minimum required work load for my second semester english teacher which resulted in a failing grade. As a result, I had to take a class in summer school. I was 1/2 credit away from graduation. Now it was a wake up call for me, I took a college level english course at COD, recieved a B on it, submitted that and successfully completed Highschool, about 8 weeks later. My principal gave me the choice to walk with my class, walk in my white robe (national honor society) stand with my class, but when she would have handed me my diploma it would have been empty and mailed to me when I completed my class later. So I can see where CPS is doing what they are doing...

my other thought is that 8th grader's can't really fail can they? I was under the understanding that if they didn't meet minimum requirements and failed a class that would be required to make that class up in summerschool, however if they showed up, eventually they were given a certificate of attendance and sent to highschool, is that correct? so, if this is correct, while you may be able to grade a student with a mark that is below acceptable, can you hold a student back?

Finally, for those students that wouldn't graduate, is the school planning on having a cerimony for them in the summer? if they are not, then is it fair to ban them from walking all together is it?

the above arguement has alot of opinions, and statements based on those, without knowing all the facts, if I am wrong, please correct me

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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
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my other thought is that 8th grader's can't really fail can they? I was under the understanding that if they didn't meet minimum requirements and failed a class that would be required to make that class up in summerschool, however if they showed up, eventually they were given a certificate of attendance and sent to highschool, is that correct? so, if this is correct, while you may be able to grade a student with a mark that is below acceptable, can you hold a student back?

Finally, for those students that wouldn't graduate, is the school planning on having a cerimony for them in the summer? if they are not, then is it fair to ban them from walking all together is it?
Yes in Chicago you can fail and repeat 8th grade you will repeat until you turn 15 and if that is the case you go to an alternative highschool where you do 8th grade work until you meet conditions to go to real high school.

Yes they have summer school graduation but the way the state f'ed up the state test cps is canceling summer graduation.

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I will sock ya square in your snot locker if you EVER use the term "Bron Bron" in my presence - BAHLEEDAT
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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 12:49 PM
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The problem starts early with these cases. By 8th grade, these kids are already far behind. In many CPS schools 8th grade students are scoring in 4th grade levels. I think this is just showing that they are giving up on these kids. The early years for these kids was their best shot to get them up to snuff. CPS knows that if they stick to the rules, some of these kids could stay in the 8th grade for 4 or more years. I'm sure they got to that grade from other teachers passing them in previous grades. It's not just CPS fault either. I'm sure many of the parents didn't help their kids out when they first started having problems. I agree that passing these kids on is not going to solve the problem, it is just passing the buck to the next guy to deal with.

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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 02:03 PM
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Not only does this reward failure, it discourages success. Who's gonna try hard when the loser next to him gets by doing nothing? Bad move...
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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
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The problem starts early with these cases. By 8th grade, these kids are already far behind. In many CPS schools 8th grade students are scoring in 4th grade levels. I think this is just showing that they are giving up on these kids.
Anyone who knows cps school teachers has no doubt heard the horror stories of how oiut of control kids are. The schools can't even get the parents to come to school to pick up report cards and the few that do b!tch them out for the "inconvenience". The biggest problem right now is that teachers have to play the role of teacher AND parent because the kids have no postive home life, and with 35 kids in a room it's not possible.
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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 02:22 PM
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This is Bush's 'no child left behind' in action. Boy does that plan suck.

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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 02:33 PM
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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 02:40 PM
 
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read Freakonomics to get a better insight into Chicago Public Schools. They have found in the past teachers were cheating on aptitude test for the students to make them look better. by removing the option to fail and be held back you are removing the incentive for the teacher to cheat.
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post #16 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadrach
This is Bush's 'no child left behind' in action. Boy does that plan suck.
Yes it does, the plan is a piece of crap.

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post #17 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 03:02 PM
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it is my understanding that they cant fail you or hold you back untill high school, without a parents permission... also, cps's are looking for dollars from property taxes... the parents may be more willing to pass a referendum if they feel like they are getting something out of it...
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post #18 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeusrotty22
it is my understanding that they cant fail you or hold you back untill high school, without a parents permission... also, cps's are looking for dollars from property taxes... the parents may be more willing to pass a referendum if they feel like they are getting something out of it...

already asked and answered

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin
Yes in Chicago you can fail and repeat 8th grade you will repeat until you turn 15 and if that is the case you go to an alternative highschool where you do 8th grade work until you meet conditions to go to real high school.

Yes they have summer school graduation but the way the state f'ed up the state test cps is canceling summer graduation.

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post #19 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 03:24 PM
 
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Yea everyone got a chance to walk at my HS...I knew a few people who still needed summer school.
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post #20 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadrach
This is Bush's 'no child left behind' in action. Boy does that plan suck.
CPS sucked long before that. IIRC, throughout the late 90's, they had the distinction of "worst in nation."

Yes, the program sucks. (Probably cuz Dubya was stupid enought to let Ted Kennedy write it. ) But blaming Bush for CPS sucking, even though they were terrible long before? Jeez.

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post #21 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 04:01 PM
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altho I agree with most everything mentioned... I am NOT gonna get on my soap box and rant cuz the post would be too long...
However, I just want to mention, that it is NOT just CPS where this is an issue. It is in nearly every middle school and HS.
I recently encountered the same thing in a central indiana school district and and an Arizona school district. So, I think it is a bit unfair to single out the CPS (even tho they DO have thier share of problems!!).

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post #22 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 04:02 PM
 
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Maybe they should make it so that if you dont pass a grade within 2 years, you get to choose the "soylant green" option. Maybe that would be motivation enough to study?
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post #23 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 04:04 PM
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Post #20, see Post #21.

Also, check out Freakenomics for interesting viewpoint on the 'NCLB' plan.

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post #24 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 04:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackrose613
altho I agree with most everything mentioned... I am NOT gonna get on my soap box and rant cuz the post would be too long...
However, I just want to mention, that it is NOT just CPS where this is an issue. It is in nearly every middle school and HS.
I recently encountered the same thing in a central indiana school district and and an Arizona school district. So, I think it is a bit unfair to single out the CPS (even tho they DO have thier share of problems!!).

That's definitely true, I think it's just because the thread started about cps that the focus is on them. A lot of schools are guilty of not enforcing personal responsibility in kids, but I do think this is more on the administrative level-- teachers do not want to pass kids who continually snub them and do nothing all year, but a lot of times it's not their decision to make.
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post #25 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-08-2006, 08:32 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackrose613
altho I agree with most everything mentioned... I am NOT gonna get on my soap box and rant cuz the post would be too long...
However, I just want to mention, that it is NOT just CPS where this is an issue. It is in nearly every middle school and HS.
I recently encountered the same thing in a central indiana school district and and an Arizona school district. So, I think it is a bit unfair to single out the CPS (even tho they DO have thier share of problems!!).


I only said CPS because that is who I teach for. I know other schools do it but it is just wrong.

Like I said nobody is getting promoted without meeting requirements they just used to have the policy of if you have summer school you graduate in August.

I hope it is a one time case for this year since the state screwed up testing

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post #26 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-09-2006, 12:07 PM
 
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Think of it this way. You made it all the way and then you're not allowed to walk because you need to complete one or more courses? That would suck. It's simply an experience. You're not magically graduating.
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