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post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:10 PM Thread Starter
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negotiating with an insurance company

okay, not going to get into specifics on this, just need a simple question answered, any opinions are fine, but I would rather not post specifics of the event or dealings. here or in PM's, I am not looking for an Atty, or legal advice.

Basically I am currently in negotiations with an insurance company over settling a personal injury out of court. They had made an initial offer on Friday November 10th. I declined the initial offer. I spoke to a few key people and got a fairly good idea of what the settlement should be and made a counter offer on morning of Thursday November 16th, I made my response in writing via email with a letter written in the same format that they sent to me as an attachment in the email. As of today, I have recieved no response from them. I have sent two followup emails enquiring about the status. They have been sitting on my offer for 5 business days (6 if you include black friday) I realize that people take this time of year off, however I have recieved no idications that this person is out of the office.

My question is this, what do I do? I know I can go and get a lawyer however I am trying to avoid that at this point.

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post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:13 PM
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post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:19 PM
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Because an offer has ben made, typicially if you hire a lawyer, they will get half of anything over the origional offer. Offer was $5, lawyer get you $10, you only get $7.50. The people that made the offer will take a while to get back to you. If they get back to you in a timely mannor, they just have to pay you that much sooner.
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post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dave13 View Post
Because an offer has ben made, typicially if you hire a lawyer, they will get half of anything over the origional offer. Offer was $5, lawyer get you $10, you only get $7.50. The people that made the offer will take a while to get back to you. If they get back to you in a timely mannor, they just have to pay you that much sooner.
whats a timely manner? are we talking two weeks? I have spoken to a lawyer about this, and was told that he would take 33% of the final settlment regardlesss if an original offer was made or not, we could negotiate something different, but that he would plan to take 33% of the final total. I am aware of all of this, the problem is that the statue of limitations is up in IL January 5th of next year, which is only just over a month away. Now the accident happened in MSP which has four additional years, but I dont want to drag it out any longer then i have to

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post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
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what does that mean? I have never had to deal with this in the past so I don't understand why you are laughing?

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post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:25 PM
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Follow up with the Post Office to make sure they received your certified letter of your counter offer. Then, find out who the agent's boss is and politely turbo it and ask when you will receive their acceptance to your counter offer. (slightly twist it on them in mid-stride)

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post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:27 PM Thread Starter
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Follow up with the Post Office to make sure they received your certified letter of your counter offer. Then, find out who the agent's boss is and politely turbo it and ask when you will receive their acceptance to your counter offer. (slightly twist it on them in mid-stride)
i never sent a certified letter, I have been dealing via email, should I mail a certified letter? i can do that, it wouldn't be difficult. also, I have been told never to call it a counter offer but a letter of demand.

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post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:28 PM
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okay, not going to get into specifics on this, just need a simple question answered, any opinions are fine, but I would rather not post specifics of the event or dealings. here or in PM's, I am not looking for an Atty, or legal advice.

Basically I am currently in negotiations with an insurance company over settling a personal injury out of court. They had made an initial offer on Friday November 10th. I declined the initial offer. I spoke to a few key people and got a fairly good idea of what the settlement should be and made a counter offer on morning of Thursday November 16th, I made my response in writing via email with a letter written in the same format that they sent to me as an attachment in the email. As of today, I have recieved no response from them. I have sent two followup emails enquiring about the status. They have been sitting on my offer for 5 business days (6 if you include black friday) I realize that people take this time of year off, however I have recieved no idications that this person is out of the office.

My question is this, what do I do? I know I can go and get a lawyer however I am trying to avoid that at this point.

With the holidays and all I would give it til' Thursday. If nothing Thursday, contact them again. Do you have their phone number? I would call them instead of emailing them, because it sounds like emailing them isn't doing anything.

I would definitely send all letters certified, otherwise, I bet everything they would use the "I didn't get anything" excuse. Have you put a return receipt on the emails?

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post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:37 PM Thread Starter
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With the holidays and all I would give it til' Thursday. If nothing Thursday, contact them again. Do you have their phone number? I would call them instead of emailing them, because it sounds like emailing them isn't doing anything.

I would definitely send all letters certified, otherwise, I bet everything they would use the "I didn't get anything" excuse. Have you put a return receipt on the emails?
all my emails have been sent return reciept

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post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:42 PM
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all my emails have been sent return reciept
Have they all came back saying that the person you are sending the emails to have read the emails? Maybe they were fired, or have been sick suddenly, and wasn't able to leave an out of office client on their email. They might not even have an out of office auto reply client on their email system??? This is why I would definitely give them a call.

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post #11 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:50 PM Thread Starter
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Have they all came back saying that the person you are sending the emails to have read the emails? Maybe they were fired, or have been sick suddenly, and wasn't able to leave an out of office client on their email. They might not even have an out of office auto reply client on their email system??? This is why I would definitely give them a call.
i know they have an out of office client because I have sent emails in the past an recieved out of office replies.

A coworker suggested sending attaching a deadline to the letter, I have not done that in the past, but am thinking of sending it certified and posting a deadline. thoughts?

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post #12 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:52 PM
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all my emails have been sent return reciept
The lawyer could be on vacation for the holidays and his para legal could be checking his emails for him or her. Thus you would get a return receipt but it may not have been actually read by the intended party yet. I would assume he wouldn't have his para contact him for anything while on holiday for all but the most time sensitive things. I second actually calling Thurs. It could be a game to see who flinches first. If the offer you eventually get is reasonable I say take it. Once you get under their skin they can draw it out for years until you run out of money going to court or any lawyer who works for free until settlement wont touch it. But like anything else, if you were wronged not to your own fault you should get proper payment. Good luck.

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post #13 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 03:59 PM Thread Starter
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The lawyer could be on vacation for the holidays and his para legal could be checking his emails for him or her. Thus you would get a return receipt but it may not have been actually read by the intended party yet. I would assume he wouldn't have his para contact him for anything while on holiday for all but the most time sensitive things. I second actually calling Thurs. It could be a game to see who flinches first. If the offer you eventually get is reasonable I say take it. Once you get under their skin they can draw it out for years until you run out of money going to court or any lawyer who works for free until settlement wont touch it. But like anything else, if you were wronged not to your own fault you should get proper payment. Good luck.

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They made an offer to pay, it just wasn't enough, I made a counter, I fealt it was fair, they have not responded. I don't know if they are waiting and playing a game or reviewing it or what, but not responding is simply unprofessional. you want a week? thats fair. you need more time then that, you should ask for it. Today was business day five, because of the holiday, thursday will be two weeks. at two weeks your past fair and into the area of simply trying my patience.

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post #14 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 04:03 PM
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i know they have an out of office client because I have sent emails in the past an recieved out of office replies.

A coworker suggested sending attaching a deadline to the letter, I have not done that in the past, but am thinking of sending it certified and posting a deadline. thoughts?
Yep, that is a good idea, I would do that, AND call on Thursday. Sometimes people put emails off to the side, and forget about them, or just do not treat them with the proper urgency as they should at times. What Under200 said was a good point, it could be his para legal is maybe checking emails, and assuming your emails can wait until he or she is back in the office or something. Good Luck.

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post #15 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 04:05 PM
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They made an offer to pay, it just wasn't enough, I made a counter, I fealt it was fair, they have not responded. I don't know if they are waiting and playing a game or reviewing it or what, but not responding is simply unprofessional. you want a week? thats fair. you need more time then that, you should ask for it. Today was business day five, because of the holiday, thursday will be two weeks. at two weeks your past fair and into the area of simply trying my patience.
Yeah, they should at least reply with a simple, I will review this and discuss it over with the other party and will get back to you in 3-5 business days or something!

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post #16 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 04:07 PM
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what does that mean? I have never had to deal with this in the past so I don't understand why you are laughing?
read the post right above the one you posted about expiring in January.

they are gonna drag your ass along for the next 40 days till it expires until a lawyer calls them and says, lets settle now, or i file a jury case against there company in the next couple days.

33% is nothing when dealing with some major corp with more money then you to just TIE a case up.



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post #17 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 06:17 PM Thread Starter
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read the post right above the one you posted about expiring in January.

they are gonna drag your ass along for the next 40 days till it expires until a lawyer calls them and says, lets settle now, or i file a jury case against there company in the next couple days.

33% is nothing when dealing with some major corp with more money then you to just TIE a case up.

I find it hard to believe that they would drag this out with the intent of me wanting them to go to court. I could believe that they are dragging there feet with the hopes that the statue of limitations expires and then I have NO legal bounds to get anything at that point.

So if you were me, Ken what would you do to get them to respond?

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post #18 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 06:35 PM
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ahh thats what i was trying to say.

get a lawyer, have him go at it for the price you wanted and his fee's also get covered. if its good enough of a case for go court!



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post #19 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 06:47 PM Thread Starter
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ahh thats what i was trying to say.

get a lawyer, have him go at it for the price you wanted and his fee's also get covered. if its good enough of a case for go court!
its without question worth going to court, I have spoken to three lawyers all agreed to take it, however all were friends of friends of friends, and suggested that it would be easier to do without going to court. They all said they would take the case if the insurance company doesn't want to deal with me. At this point it's starting to look that way which sucks.

anyway, I will post in this thread when I have some news, thanks everybody

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post #20 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 06:49 PM
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1. Everything goes via certified mail.

2. Offer should only be valid for xx days - then it is automatically rescinded unless it is accepted in writting and payment is recieved infull within yy days.

3. They have a lot more experience than you and they will take advantage of you. I'm not a big fan of lawyers & legal battles, but unless you have a lawyer friend guiding you through the process, you may need to hire someone to protect your rights.

4. The fact that they made an offer is a good sign, but it may have only been a 'feeler.' Your response and multiple follow-ups and lack of legal representation is likely being seen as a sign of weakness. They may be changing their game plan based on how you responded.

I would line up an lawyer to take over with the following stipulations:
- lawyer only takes over after xx date ONLY if case is not already about to settle.
- lawyer must be prepared to respond promptly on xx date to protect your rights within statue of limitations.


Good luck with everything - but I think you are really behind the 8-ball with the statue of limitations running out !! Why did you end up waiting so long ???

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post #21 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 09:28 AM Thread Starter
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1. Everything goes via certified mail.

2. Offer should only be valid for xx days - then it is automatically rescinded unless it is accepted in writting and payment is recieved infull within yy days.

3. They have a lot more experience than you and they will take advantage of you. I'm not a big fan of lawyers & legal battles, but unless you have a lawyer friend guiding you through the process, you may need to hire someone to protect your rights.

4. The fact that they made an offer is a good sign, but it may have only been a 'feeler.' Your response and multiple follow-ups and lack of legal representation is likely being seen as a sign of weakness. They may be changing their game plan based on how you responded.

I would line up an lawyer to take over with the following stipulations:
- lawyer only takes over after xx date ONLY if case is not already about to settle.
- lawyer must be prepared to respond promptly on xx date to protect your rights within statue of limitations.


Good luck with everything - but I think you are really behind the 8-ball with the statue of limitations running out !! Why did you end up waiting so long ???

It took this long to fully recover, and also there was a workmans comp case that had to be settled first. I am working with a few different lawyers, and all have been guiding me through the process. It does appear that i am behind the 8-ball on this, and I am more then willing to take this to a lawyer and let them battle it out in court however the amount of money that is in this case, it's hard to justify a lawyer.

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post #22 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 01:33 PM Thread Starter
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pursuant to everybody's advice I have gone ahead and sent a certified letter, the same letter that was emailed, however this time I added a deadline of next wednesday, I will make no further attempts to contact, if my emails / voicemail / and letter go unresponded to, I will contact the lawyer and let him take it from here

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post #23 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-30-2006, 07:46 PM Thread Starter
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***update***

well they responded. They brought up there offer 8%, however they are still not even 50% to where they need to be. I spoke to an authoritative figure on the subject, given that they moved up is a good sign, however they are still approximately 57% away from what I believe to be an acceptable offer. My current counter offer is 57% higher then what I deem as a base acceptable number. So basically the acceptable number is exactly in the middle.

I sent my response via email, I recieved theres via email, but I also put in the email that I will be sending it certified, and also that it is an offer that expires with me resorting to legal counsole as of 5pm friday next week (dec 8th)

here is where I screwed up. I made a math mistake in my head and assumed they increased there offer 25% and instead it was only 8%. the problem was that I went down the exact same amount as I THOUGHT they came up. so while I wanted to send a message that I was hoping to meet them halfway, instead I gave more then I wanted.

did I screw up?

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post #24 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-30-2006, 08:23 PM

 
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***update***

well they responded. They brought up there offer 8%, however they are still not even 50% to where they need to be. I spoke to an authoritative figure on the subject, given that they moved up is a good sign, however they are still approximately 57% away from what I believe to be an acceptable offer. My current counter offer is 57% higher then what I deem as a base acceptable number. So basically the acceptable number is exactly in the middle.

I sent my response via email, I recieved theres via email, but I also put in the email that I will be sending it certified, and also that it is an offer that expires with me resorting to legal counsole as of 5pm friday next week (dec 8th)

here is where I screwed up. I made a math mistake in my head and assumed they increased there offer 25% and instead it was only 8%. the problem was that I went down the exact same amount as I THOUGHT they came up. so while I wanted to send a message that I was hoping to meet them halfway, instead I gave more then I wanted.

did I screw up?
I wouldn't think so...when they come back with a slight raise over their current offer you can argue that you were trying to give a little more in your initial counter offer to show that your attempting to be reasonable and flexible. You can further argue that although you were offering a good will gesture by adjusting your counter offer down over 3x the value that they initially raised you that they are showing they are not being reasonable or flexible and as a result you can counter offer them back at what you just countered them at.....did this make any sense at all??

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post #25 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-30-2006, 08:30 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by FIRECAT View Post
I wouldn't think so...when they come back with a slight raise over their current offer you can argue that you were trying to give a little more in your initial counter offer to show that your attempting to be reasonable and flexible. You can further argue that although you were offering a good will gesture by adjusting your counter offer down over 3x the value that they initially raised you that they are showing they are not being reasonable or flexible and as a result you can counter offer them back at what you just countered them at.....did this make any sense at all??
yes, thanks i never thought of it that way.

<-- Chris

turn the bars left and go right; that just isn't right
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post #26 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-30-2006, 08:39 PM Thread Starter
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another question,

how many rounds at the negotiation table should I expect to go through? a few people have suggested that I just be frank with them and tell them what I want. Explain that I have spoken to an atty and he believes that its worth what it is and my offer is resonable, type thing.

THanks again for the help everybody

<-- Chris

turn the bars left and go right; that just isn't right
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post #27 of 32 (permalink) Old 11-30-2006, 09:15 PM
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you better buy us some beers!

so far you looking good.

i am surprised they responded!



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post #28 of 32 (permalink) Old 12-01-2006, 09:08 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Odysseys View Post
you better buy us some beers!

so far you looking good.

i am surprised they responded!
Ken, for all the advice and help i have gotten from this board, I would awe and aweful lot of people an aweful lot of beer.

as for her responding, im not suprised, however the fact that they are at like 40% of my accept and only came up like 3% of my acceptable offer. This leads me to two things, #1, they are playing games with me, in an attempt to press me up against the statuete of limitations. That or, they don't have that much wiggle room.

does anybody know how many trips to the table we should have before I draw a line in the sand? one person said that if I should do it at the next step. Others said that I continue to play there game over and over again

<-- Chris

turn the bars left and go right; that just isn't right
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post #29 of 32 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 05:55 PM Thread Starter
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***update***

well I went back to the table with a second offer, the counter offer carried with it a expiration of today at 5pm. I left my office early today, so unless they called and left a message, I have to assume it's time for this to get handed off to the lawyers. I was really hoping to be able to settle this on my own, however it appears in this case that there is to large of a gap between my interests and those of the insurance companies. Monday morning (assuming, they didn't leave me a message) I will be contacting the atty who gave me the fair market value estimation in the first place and going through the steps to get this completed.

<-- Chris

turn the bars left and go right; that just isn't right
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post #30 of 32 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 06:13 PM
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that sucks, but i was expecting this to go this route. get a good lawyer and a PROMPT lawyer to work on it, tell them right up front if i am going to hire you!, then you need to work immediately on this die to the time limitations now on the matter!



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