Any of you see this video? Scary stuff.. Could happen to us... - Chicagoland Sportbikes
Chicagoland Sportbikes
 
Open Forum This forum is for all off-topic discussion.

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 03:44 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
iamnotgreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 12,529
Location: Chicago
Sportbike: 2003 Aprilia Mille R Colin Edwards / 01-02 Ninj ZX6r Tracktoy / 2003 SV650
Years Riding: 12
How you found us: some guy at the IBM credit union told me about it
           
Any of you see this video? Scary stuff.. Could happen to us...

I say that because I read somewhere that sportbikers tend to break the speedlimit more than Prius owners do...

Damn.

They tasered him for not signing the ticket?

I get the feeling one cop is gonna be out of a job and one guy is going to get out of his ticket and get a new house on our dime.

Quote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMaMYL_shxc
iamnotgreg is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 03:49 PM
Who's faster Lupi
 
Champ91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Lake in the Hills, IL
Posts: 4,957
Location: Lake in the Hills, IL
Sportbike: 2004 ZX10R & 2005 CRF50
Years Riding: 20
How you found us: SBN
           
Maybe he should have signed the ticket and done as the officer asked and not refuse his orders and walk away after being arrested. But hey I wasnt there and would have just signed the ticket in the first place it would never have escallated.

NESBA #456 Intermediate
Always 1 step ahead of Lupi. 1:24:7 BHF
And 1 step behind Kimmy

"SoB gets to spend yet ANOTHER season faster than me." -LUPI-
Champ91 is offline  
post #3 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 03:56 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
iamnotgreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 12,529
Location: Chicago
Sportbike: 2003 Aprilia Mille R Colin Edwards / 01-02 Ninj ZX6r Tracktoy / 2003 SV650
Years Riding: 12
How you found us: some guy at the IBM credit union told me about it
           
I suppose...
Cop was being kind of a tool.. I am sure you didn't watch what all happened.. Seeing as you replied to it about 5 min after I posted a 10 min video...
That said I let it load up and skipped around to the good parts myself

The guy didn't need to taser him.. I guess that's my point all to often.. As I am big and scary.. and that cop looked like a little (censored-censored) with some power to me...
iamnotgreg is offline  
post #4 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 05:25 PM
Who's faster Lupi
 
Champ91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Lake in the Hills, IL
Posts: 4,957
Location: Lake in the Hills, IL
Sportbike: 2004 ZX10R & 2005 CRF50
Years Riding: 20
How you found us: SBN
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by gconsier View Post
I suppose...
Cop was being kind of a tool.. I am sure you didn't watch what all happened.. Seeing as you replied to it about 5 min after I posted a 10 min video...
That said I let it load up and skipped around to the good parts myself

The guy didn't need to taser him.. I guess that's my point all to often.. As I am big and scary.. and that cop looked like a little (censored-censored) with some power to me...

Actually its been loaded all over the internet and I saw it over on ZX-10R.net 30 minutes before I saw your post. And yes I watched the entire video.

http://www.zx-10r.net/forum/showthread.php?t=48265

NESBA #456 Intermediate
Always 1 step ahead of Lupi. 1:24:7 BHF
And 1 step behind Kimmy

"SoB gets to spend yet ANOTHER season faster than me." -LUPI-

Last edited by Champ91; 11-21-2007 at 06:33 PM.
Champ91 is offline  
post #5 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 06:08 PM
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,028
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Champ91 View Post
Actually its been loaded all over the internet and I saw it over on ZX-10R.net 30 minutes before I saw your post. And yes I watched the entire video.
children... That cop was not in his right to tase him... Thats the bottom line... You dont have to sign anything, the guy was not resisting... Nor was he threatening...
zeusrotty is offline  
post #6 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 06:11 PM
habitual line stepper
 
Jack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,235
Location: Wisconsin
Sportbike: F4,Brutale,Warrior,DRZ
Years Riding: X
How you found us: .
           
Send a message via AIM to Jack
that cop is an idiot.
Jack is offline  
post #7 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 06:13 PM
Hot-Wire Her With A Pin
 
Paladin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: County Hell
Posts: 8,791
Location: County Hell
Sportbike: Blue Mini Cooper
Years Riding: Done for now
How you found us: Bad weather bikers
           
Send a message via Yahoo to Paladin
I saw no problem with it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug View Post
I will sock ya square in your snot locker if you EVER use the term "Bron Bron" in my presence - BAHLEEDAT
Paladin is offline  
post #8 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 06:27 PM
Si Vis Pacem Parabellum
 
SmartDrug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bartlett
Posts: 11,409
Location: Bartlett
Sportbike: 955i Speed Triple, 100AE Road King, AP1 Honda S2000
Years Riding: 1/3rd of my life.
How you found us: Cave Johnson
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I saw no problem with it
Are you serious?

That cop needs to be washing dishes for the rest of his life.

Brian
NESBA #22
الكافرة مع بندقية سوداء
Si vis pacem parabellum

Quote:
Yeah, I quit doing blow, not being rad!
SmartDrug is offline  
post #9 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 06:29 PM
Irony helps us play!
 
Arch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: N'ville
Posts: 29,508
Location: N'ville
Sportbike: 2000 F4
Years Riding: Long enough to know better
How you found us: some hot MILF whispered it in my ear
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeusrotty View Post
children... That cop was not in his right to tase him... Thats the bottom line... You dont have to sign anything, the guy was not resisting... Nor was he threatening...
He was disobeying putting the officer (with what appears to be a serious 'superiority complex') into his discomfort zone which he could easily take as a threat (and obviously did).

Everyone Exaggerates

We're being taken for a ride... agaaaaaaain.....


Best Auto/Moto Insurance | Motorcycle Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
Arch is offline  
post #10 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:01 PM
Registered User
 
Kneeinpain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Arlington Heights
Posts: 813
Location: Arlington Heights
Sportbike: '14 BMW S1000R, '06 Triumph Scrambler / '06 BMW R1200GSA
Years Riding: Long time...
How you found us: VTR 996 - in '02
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Champ91 View Post
Maybe he should have signed the ticket and done as the officer asked and not refuse his orders and walk away after being arrested. But hey I wasnt there and would have just signed the ticket in the first place it would never have escallated.
Who are you kidding, Champ? You no doubt would have gotten out and given him the Zsa Zsa Gabor treatment...

Tom / '06 Triumph Scrambler / '06 BMW R1200GSA / 1969 Honda Mini-Trail / '14 BMW S1000R
Kneeinpain is offline  
post #11 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:05 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
iamnotgreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 12,529
Location: Chicago
Sportbike: 2003 Aprilia Mille R Colin Edwards / 01-02 Ninj ZX6r Tracktoy / 2003 SV650
Years Riding: 12
How you found us: some guy at the IBM credit union told me about it
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Champ91 View Post
Actually its been loaded all over the internet and I saw it over on ZX-10R.net 30 minutes before I saw your post. And yes I watched the entire video.

http://www.zx-10r.net/forum/showthread.php?t=48265
Touche!

(flame suit on)
You couldn't tell that well.. but I bet the cop was short. Short cops and lady cops... Always out to prove something(flame suit off) hahahahah

ok.. that was half in jest.. but we all know there is a grain of truth to it
iamnotgreg is offline  
post #12 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:08 PM
Wooohooo
 
XxMarsxX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Palatine IL
Posts: 2,207
Location: Palatine IL
Sportbike: 2007 GSXR-600K7
Years Riding: Year 3
How you found us: This isn't where I parked my car.
           
Send a message via AIM to XxMarsxX Send a message via MSN to XxMarsxX
His hand was going for his pocket and he was walking away from the cop and not following orders...

-Mo
XxMarsxX is offline  
post #13 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:12 PM
Registered User
 
ThirdgenTa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Aurora
Posts: 1,512
Location: Aurora
Sportbike: 2001 zx6
How you found us: Search
           
Send a message via AIM to ThirdgenTa
Well.... The guy who was being an asshole and pushing buttons with the cop.
But that didn't give the cop the right to taze him. The cop didn't even physically try anything. You start with the lowest force possible and move up if it doesn't work. He just whipped it out and shot at him.
I'm sure he got in some kind of trouble though.
He also wasn't very good at justifying his actions.
ThirdgenTa is offline  
post #14 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:25 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
iamnotgreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 12,529
Location: Chicago
Sportbike: 2003 Aprilia Mille R Colin Edwards / 01-02 Ninj ZX6r Tracktoy / 2003 SV650
Years Riding: 12
How you found us: some guy at the IBM credit union told me about it
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by XxMarsxX View Post
His hand was going for his pocket and he was walking away from the cop and not following orders...
If you are that big of a chickensh*t p*ssy.. Don't become a cop.. Pick something less dangerous...

Cops, soldiers, bouncers... other jobs like that.. a reasonable sense of "not a complete p*ssy" should be part of the job description..

Sadly it isn't.. but in my perfect world he would have chosen a different career.


Not that I hate him specifically.. I just have had similar experiences with "gangsters in blue" and I know their "nothing I do is wrong" "nobody will ever believe you" or the punch you in the face for no reason and then say you were resisting attitude.. I picked one up by his shirt once and held him up with his feet 6" off the ground for a minute or two till he promised he wouldn't hit me any more... He did.. but he lied.. he at least had the decency to wait until I let him cuff me to hit me again.. then he pulled his gun and almost dropped it he was so scared when we got out of the cop car and walked into the little holding cell (one horse town.. i was in high school) and I handed him the cuffs.

I'll never forget the "you're lucky it wasn't dark out you little punk cuz I'd have fucking killed you" quote when I got in the car.. I replied with "really? didn't look to me like you were doing so well in there stumpy" (he was short)

He proceeded to tell me how I was going to spend the next few days getting "Ass raped by n*ggers" blah blah..

Turns out he was the acting cheif at the time.. few months later he got in trouble and was bumped down.. then a few months after that the papers found out that he knew a fireman friend of his was screwing his 14 yr old girl and helped him "make it go away" - after 25+ years he was bumped all the way down to speedtrap...

Now all that said (and that obviously wasnt the whole story) I do not have an issue with 99% of the cops out there.. It's the 1% that give all the others a crap reputation to deal with I can't stand.. I have a # of friends who are cops and are really good people.
iamnotgreg is offline  
post #15 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:30 PM
.
 
Ryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chicago
Posts: 4,985
Location: Chicago
Sportbike: 05 DRZ-SM, 80 GS1100E, 99 KTM 125SX, 03 KTM 200MXC
Years Riding: Since 2001
How you found us: ?
           
Send a message via AIM to Ryan Send a message via Yahoo to Ryan
That guy was generally being an asshole and kept getting ready to stick his hand in his pocket. I don't know what the proper procedure for tasering someone is but it looked to me like he had it coming. The bottom line when dealing with the police is be polite and do what they say and you probably won't get tasered. I used to get hassled and slapped around by the cops all the time when I was a smartass little stoner kid and I deserved it. Eventually I grew up and realized that being polite goes a long way.
Ryan is offline  
post #16 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:31 PM
JMN
Fornello Del Testicolo
 
JMN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pingree Grove
Posts: 410
Location: Pingree Grove
Sportbike: 996
Years Riding: since 85'
How you found us: Google
           
No matter how out of line an officer is I'm doing what he says. He did say one thing that I agree with - "the side of the road is not the place to argue...". Right or wrong I'll take my chances with a lawyer. I think that's the only way you're going to have a chance to "win". It would be nice if you could argue with cops when they're wrong but if that was acceptable then we'd have a lot more of these videos and I think too many of them wouldn't end as innocuously as this one. Not a huge fan of police but they do have to be able to act with a certain level of authority for the system to work, it's just unfortunate that they can't be perfect on every stop. Not a perfect system but I'm also a registered voter if I don't like it and that, and the courts, are my avenues to effect change in laws I disagree with(yes I know also not a perfect system ). For what it's worth I've stood in front of the judge and listened to the officer flat-out lie, but despite that experience I still try and judge on a case by case basis. Nobody posts videos of police that are within their right and courteous.

~Jesse

"Our Lady of Blessed Acceleration, don't fail me now!"
JMN is offline  
post #17 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:33 PM
RRA
Rick Rides Again
 
RRA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Lindenwood, IL
Posts: 323
Location: Lindenwood, IL
Sportbike: 2005 FJR1300A
Years Riding: 20+
How you found us: members
           
Legally, it boils down to, is ordering someone to sign a ticket a legal order. You can be arrested for not obeying a legal order. If it's not the cop should be washing dishes.

If it is, I think the cop was way to fast on the trigger and should be removed from the street. He made no effort to explain what was going on, or what would result if the speeder did not obey. Something that should always be done before violence is used.

The fact that the cop resorted to violence that quickly is very disturbing to me.

RRA

RC
05' FJR
"Punching a hole in the bugosphere"
RRA is offline  
post #18 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:37 PM
NAEMT- Paramedic, RN
 
cp3823's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sterling, IL
Posts: 501
Location: Sterling, IL
Sportbike: 2007 CBR 600rr
Years Riding: 6 years riding street bikes
How you found us: chicago riders
           
a cop giving you an order to "sign a ticket" is not a true legal order, Atleast not in IL. I just asked our local PD here that happened to stop by the hospial ER. Just because a cop tells you to do something, does not always mean you have to do it. Same way with when a cop arrests you. If a cop attempts to make an illegial arrest, you can do with whatever in your power, and if you fear for you life, you can use violent force to escape. Now before any dipshits attempt to flame this or call bullsh*t, look it up or call a lawyer.
cp3823 is offline  
post #19 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:38 PM
Si Vis Pacem Parabellum
 
SmartDrug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bartlett
Posts: 11,409
Location: Bartlett
Sportbike: 955i Speed Triple, 100AE Road King, AP1 Honda S2000
Years Riding: 1/3rd of my life.
How you found us: Cave Johnson
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan View Post
That guy was generally being an asshole and kept getting ready to stick his hand in his pocket. I don't know what the proper procedure for tasering someone is but it looked to me like he had it coming. The bottom line when dealing with the police is be polite and do what they say and you probably won't get tasered. I used to get hassled and slapped around by the cops all the time when I was a smartass little stoner kid and I deserved it. Eventually I grew up and realized that being polite goes a long way.
I agree with this wholeheartedly, you're absolutely right.

BUT... There's no way I would have signed that ticket either. If there was no speed listed on the ticket, you're goddamn right I'm going to fight it, that's like signing a blank check. I don't think the guy was being a jerk about contesting the fact that he wasn't told if his violation, he sounded reasonable and rational to me; then he was on his back with a taser prong inside him (that sounded dirty!), which is bullshite.

Brian
NESBA #22
الكافرة مع بندقية سوداء
Si vis pacem parabellum

Quote:
Yeah, I quit doing blow, not being rad!
SmartDrug is offline  
post #20 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 07:59 PM
Your friendly Crazy Canuk
 
RickC1957's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Barrington, Illinois
Posts: 12,731
Location: Barrington, Illinois
Sportbike: Ducati ST3 2005 Gloss Black, Monster 620, 2007 Sport Classic 1000
Years Riding: Crashing sucessfully since 1969
How you found us: Thru favorednation (ron)
           
Send a message via AIM to RickC1957 Send a message via Yahoo to RickC1957
I have been a victim of the "blue gangsters" also....been verbally assualted, physically assaulted, I trust no cop in blues...I suggest to everyone that is pulled over by someone in blue, do whatever they tell you, take them to court, use the law in your favor. Arguing with these folks is like arguing with a pissed off bull elephant

Sometimes goodbye is your second chance.
RickC1957 is offline  
post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 08:02 PM
GO RIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
FATTKAW's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: romeoville IL
Posts: 433
Location: romeoville IL
Sportbike: 04 ZX-10R 08 KLR650 76 RD400
Years Riding: 21
How you found us: friend
           
you do not have to sign and not a reason to arrests someone. I'm with the cop's on things like this most of the time but he handled it poorly. he never said I'm going to arrest you if you don't sign, at least I didn't hear it. anybody know the outcome of the cop.
FATTKAW is offline  
post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 09:01 PM
Hot-Wire Her With A Pin
 
Paladin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: County Hell
Posts: 8,791
Location: County Hell
Sportbike: Blue Mini Cooper
Years Riding: Done for now
How you found us: Bad weather bikers
           
Send a message via Yahoo to Paladin
The side of the road is not the court room. How do you suggest the cop respond physically? A struggle on the side of the road with traffic? The cop is out numbered yes it was a girl in the car but being hit with a tire iron is the same. Let the guy drive off to do a felony stop with back up? Subduing a person is a lot harder than it seems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug View Post
I will sock ya square in your snot locker if you EVER use the term "Bron Bron" in my presence - BAHLEEDAT
Paladin is offline  
post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 09:15 PM
NAEMT- Paramedic, RN
 
cp3823's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sterling, IL
Posts: 501
Location: Sterling, IL
Sportbike: 2007 CBR 600rr
Years Riding: 6 years riding street bikes
How you found us: chicago riders
           
A tire iron? where did that come from :-)

I know what you mean about the road and not being a courtroom and the trooper not wanting a fight, but there was no fight and he did not even start to be violent. The cop over reacted. That would be like me cardioverting someone in the ER before they go into SVT while they are in a NSR rythm on the grounds that they may just possibly change rythms.


Moral of the story, You take steps. You dont just whip out your XP-79 just because your a cop any you have watched the 45 minute video and sat through a 1 hour 30 minute class.

Just my thoughts
cp3823 is offline  
post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 09:39 PM
Registered User
 
JRSMAIL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Johnsburg, Il
Posts: 9,428
Location: Johnsburg, Il
Sportbike: A weed wacker
Years Riding: Just started today as a matter of fact..
How you found us: A dream I had once
           
Send a message via MSN to JRSMAIL
The cop is a tool and I'm sure after review of the video as the reason it's on you tube now, the cop got it handed to him.

How esle do you think the video is on youtube? That is not public till after the hearing.

Jon
MSF Instructor


<---- Useless

Always Stand For What You Believe In... Even If Means You Stand Alone...
JRSMAIL is offline  
post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 09:59 PM
Who's faster Lupi
 
Champ91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Lake in the Hills, IL
Posts: 4,957
Location: Lake in the Hills, IL
Sportbike: 2004 ZX10R & 2005 CRF50
Years Riding: 20
How you found us: SBN
           
ABC Write up.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3899692&page=1

Fox

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,312466,00.html

NESBA #456 Intermediate
Always 1 step ahead of Lupi. 1:24:7 BHF
And 1 step behind Kimmy

"SoB gets to spend yet ANOTHER season faster than me." -LUPI-

Last edited by Champ91; 11-21-2007 at 10:04 PM.
Champ91 is offline  
post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 10:02 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,923
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I saw no problem with it
+1 ..he resisted arrest and did not follow instruction. It is non lethal ...whats the big deal? If I were king, if you don't listen to a cop, you get a beat down. Nuff said.
Brian is offline  
post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 10:09 PM
habitual line stepper
 
Jack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,235
Location: Wisconsin
Sportbike: F4,Brutale,Warrior,DRZ
Years Riding: X
How you found us: .
           
Send a message via AIM to Jack
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
+1 ..he resisted arrest and did not follow instruction. It is non lethal ...whats the big deal? If I were king, if you don't listen to a cop, you get a beat down. Nuff said.

Tell that to the guy's family in a local town that was killed by being tasered.
Jack is offline  
post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 10:09 PM
GO RIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
FATTKAW's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: romeoville IL
Posts: 433
Location: romeoville IL
Sportbike: 04 ZX-10R 08 KLR650 76 RD400
Years Riding: 21
How you found us: friend
           
what was he being arrested for??
FATTKAW is offline  
post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 10:14 PM
habitual line stepper
 
Jack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,235
Location: Wisconsin
Sportbike: F4,Brutale,Warrior,DRZ
Years Riding: X
How you found us: .
           
Send a message via AIM to Jack
http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=460077

Quote:
Amnesty International, which has called on law enforcement to suspend use of the Taser, has said that 150 people have died after being struck by Tasers in the United States since June 2001.
Jack is offline  
post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-21-2007, 10:15 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,923
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack View Post
Tell that to the guy's family in a local town that was killed by being tasered.
Again ..I will never be tazered, and it will be no accident. If you do not listen to instruction, you get the consequences of your actions.
Brian is offline  
Closed Thread

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Chicagoland Sportbikes forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome