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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 04:38 PM Thread Starter
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Props to the retired Military vet

Retired Green Beret shoots intruder, gets court martial



BREVARD, Jan. 19, 2008 - Retired Army Green Beret Smokey Taylor got his
court martial this weekend and came away feeling good about it.
Taylor, at age 80 the oldest member of Chapter XXXIII of the Special
Forces Association, was on trial by his peers under the charge of
"failing to use a weapon of sufficient caliber" in the shooting of an
intruder at his home in Knoxville, TN, in December.
The entire affair, of course, was very much tongue in cheek. Taylor had
been awakened in the early morning hours of Dec. 17, 2007, when an
intruder broke into his home. He investigated the noises with one of his
many weapons in hand.
When the intruder threatened him with a knife, Taylor warned him, then
brought his .22 caliber pistol to bear and shot him right between the
eyes.
"That boy had the hardest head I've ever seen," Taylor said after his
trial. "The bullet bounced right off."
The impact knocked the would-be thief down momentarily. He crawled out
of the room then got up and ran out the door and down the street.
Knoxville police apprehended him a few blocks away and he now awaits
trial in the Knox County jail.
The charges against Taylor were considered to be serious. He is a
retired Special Forces Weapons Sergeant with extensive combat experience
during the wars in Korea and Vietnam.
"Charges were brought against him under the premise that he should have
saved the county and taxpayers the expense of a trial," said Chapter
XXXIII President Bill Long of Asheville. "He could have used a .45 or
...38. The .22 just wasn't big enough to get the job done."
Taylor's defense attorney, another retired Weapons Sergeant, disagreed.
He said Taylor had done the right thing in choosing to arm himself with
a .22.
"If he'd used a .45 or something like that the round would have gone
right through the perp, the wall, the neighbor's wall and possibly
injured some innocent child asleep in its bed," he said. "I believe the
evidence shows that Smokey Taylor exercised excellent judgment in his
choice of weapons. He did nothing wrong, and clearly remains to this day
an excellent weapons man."
Counsel for the defense then floated a theory as to why the bullet
bounced off the perp's forehead.
"He was victimized by old ammunition," he said, "just as he was in Korea
and again in Vietnam, when his units were issued ammo left over from
World War II."
Taylor said nothing in his own defense, choosing instead to allow his
peers to debate the matter. After the trial he said the ammunition was
indeed old and added the new information that the perp had soiled his
pants as he crawled out of the house.
"I would have had an even worse mess to clean up if it had gone through
his forehead," Taylor said. "It was good for both of us that it didn't."
Following testimony from both sides, Taylor was acquitted of the charges
and was given a round of applause.
Meanwhile, back in Knox County, the word is out: Don't go messing with
Smokey Taylor. He just bought a whole bunch of fresh ammo.

go time traveler style and go back in time, fuck his grandma, then shoot forward in time and then fuck his mom. Then return back to present state and call him a the product of two incest whores and hes your son and show video of you plowing the both members of his family. .
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:29 PM
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Kind of sick that they held a mock Court Martial, doesn't strike me as being funny at all.

Good for the guy for stopping the perp though.

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:33 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by SmartDrug View Post
Kind of sick that they held a mock Court Martial, doesn't strike me as being funny at all.

Good for the guy for stopping the perp though.
Who said it was funny

go time traveler style and go back in time, fuck his grandma, then shoot forward in time and then fuck his mom. Then return back to present state and call him a the product of two incest whores and hes your son and show video of you plowing the both members of his family. .
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by code2medic View Post
Who said it was funny
Why else would they hold it? He has no actual ties to the military anymore, it was done by his friends as a gag (at least that's how I read it). It's just a bit morbid that they're harassing him for not using a round that would have killed the perp in one shot.


FWIW, I'm all about deadly force for self defense, I have a shotgun and a handgun next to my bed every night. That being said, there's a reason robbery doesn't carry a death sentence, so I think joking about how the perp should have been killed is a bit strange. This is coming from the guy who earlier today suggested forced birth control for young women, so take everything I say with a grain of salt...

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Last edited by SmartDrug; 01-31-2008 at 05:38 PM.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmartDrug View Post
Why else would they hold it? He has no actual ties to the military anymore, it was done by his friends as a gag (at least that's how I read it). It's just a bit morbid that they're harassing him for not using a round that would have killed the perp in one shot.


FWIW, I'm all about deadly force for self defense, I have a shotgun and a handgun next to my bed every night. That being said, there's a reason robbery doesn't carry a death sentence, so I think joking about how the perp should have been killed is a bit strange. This is coming from the guy who earlier today suggested forced birth control for young women, so take everything I say with a grain of salt...
I've never heard that you had any military experience, and I sure don't, but Special Forces/Green Berets/etc are a different kind of animal. For years they are taught and trained how to kill. It becomes part of them, they are potentially morbid anyway. The guys was in 2 wars, probably has a couple kills, the rest of his squad probably does as well. They go in armed to do the job and are giving him crap cause he forgot his training. Think of it like giving a Boy Scout crap cause he didn't have a pen (always prepared or w/e, I wasn't a Boy Scout). Just a different way to look at it, and I could be way off base but that's how I saw it.

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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:48 PM
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Oh boy, another cold weather debate on the way!
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja 13 View Post
I've never heard that you had any military experience, and I sure don't, but Special Forces/Green Berets/etc are a different kind of animal. For years they are taught and trained how to kill. It becomes part of them, they are potentially morbid anyway. Just a different way to look at it.
FWIW 4 years ROTC, 2 years National Guard, true story. You're probably right about the special forces guys, but it still strikes me as being off color.

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmartDrug View Post
FWIW 4 years ROTC, 2 years National Guard, true story. You're probably right about the special forces guys, but it still strikes me as being off color.

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sorry I missed that, thank you for the service.

I do agree with you, it is disturbing they'd hold this "trial", but not surprising based on who they are and what they spent their lives doing.

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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:55 PM Thread Starter
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I am with Suh-c on this one

go time traveler style and go back in time, fuck his grandma, then shoot forward in time and then fuck his mom. Then return back to present state and call him a the product of two incest whores and hes your son and show video of you plowing the both members of his family. .
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 11:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninja 13 View Post
I've never heard that you had any military experience, and I sure don't, but Special Forces/Green Berets/etc are a different kind of animal. For years they are taught and trained how to kill. It becomes part of them, they are potentially morbid anyway. The guys was in 2 wars, probably has a couple kills, the rest of his squad probably does as well. They go in armed to do the job and are giving him crap cause he forgot his training. Think of it like giving a Boy Scout crap cause he didn't have a pen (always prepared or w/e, I wasn't a Boy Scout). Just a different way to look at it, and I could be way off base but that's how I saw it.
SF guys live among us, you wouldn't know them from other people unless you really knew what you were looking for.

And it was common to carry a .22 to "pop" someone in the head if need be. Relatively quiet, generally does go through the head and do it's job.

Where's a link to the real article? It is actually real or just put out by Soros?

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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-01-2008, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmartDrug View Post
FWIW 4 years ROTC, 2 years National Guard, true story. You're probably right about the special forces guys, but it still strikes me as being off color.
That ain't worth shit. Please don't mention that garbage again. J/K. Some of the best Green Berets I've worked with were from the National Guard.
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-01-2008, 07:48 AM
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I'm glad to hear he didn't allow himself to become a victim.

Props to the old man. The kid is one lucky SOB.

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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-01-2008, 08:06 AM
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I am with Suh-c on this one
You post and run?
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-01-2008, 08:18 AM
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Some light reading for you.

Here is a copy of the use of force laws in Texas. I bolded two parts, but there are some others if you feel like reading past the first couple paragraphs.

In this chapter:

(1) "Custody" has the meaning assigned by Section 38.01.

(2) "Escape" has the meaning assigned by Section 38.01.

(3) "Deadly force" means force that is intended or known by the actor to cause, or in the manner of its use or intended use is capable of causing, death or serious bodily injury.

9.02. Justification as a defense.

It is a defense to prosecution that the conduct in question is justified under this chapter.

9.03. Confinement as justifiable force.

Confinement is justified when force is justified by this chapter if the actor takes reasonable measures to terminate the confinement as soon as he knows he safely can unless the person confined has been arrested for an offense.

9.04. Threats as justifiable force.

The threat of force is justified when the use of force is justified by this chapter. For purposes of this section, a threat to cause death or serious bodily injury by the production of a weapon or otherwise, as long as the actor's purpose is limited to creating an apprehension that he will use deadly force if necessary, does not constitute the use of deadly force.

9.05. Reckless injury of innocent third person.

Even though an actor is justified under this chapter in threatening or using force or deadly force against another, if in doing so he also recklessly injures or kills an innocent third person, the justification afforded by this chapter is unavailable in a prosecution for the reckless injury or killing of the innocent third person.

9.06. Civil remedies unaffected.

The fact that conduct is justified under this chapter does not abolish or impair any remedy for the conduct that is available in a civil suit.

SUBCHAPTER B. JUSTIFICATION GENERALLY

9.21. Public duty.

(a) Except as qualified by Subsections (b) and (c), conduct is justified if the actor reasonably believes the conduct is required or authorized by law, by the judgment or order of a competent court or other governmental tribunal, or in the execution of legal process.

(b) The other sections of this chapter control when force is used against a person to protect persons (Subchapter C), to protect property (Subchapter D), for law enforcement (Subchapter E), or by virtue of a special relationship (Subchapter F).

(c) The use of deadly force is not justified under this section unless the actor reasonably believes the deadly force is specifically required by statute or unless it occurs in the lawful conduct of war. If deadly force is so justified, there is no duty to retreat before using it.

(d) The justification afforded by this section is available if the actor reasonably believes:

(1) the court or governmental tribunal has jurisdiction or the process is lawful, even though the court or governmental tribunal lacks jurisdiction or the process is unlawful; or

(2) his conduct is required or authorized to assist a public servant in the performance of his official duty, even though the servant exceeds his lawful authority.

9.22. Necessity.

Conduct is justified if:

(1) the actor reasonably believes the conduct is immediately necessary to avoid imminent harm;

(2) the desirability and urgency of avoiding the harm clearly outweigh, according to ordinary standards of reasonableness, the harm sought to be prevented by the law proscribing the conduct; and

(3) a legislative purpose to exclude the justification claimed for the conduct does not otherwise plainly appear.

SUBCHAPTER C. PROTECTION OF PERSONS

9.31. Self defense.

(a) Except as provided in Subsection (b), a person is justified in using force against another when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful force.

(b) The use of force against another is not justified:

(1) in the response to verbal provocation alone;

(2) to resist an arrest or search that the actor knows is being made by a peace officer, or by a person acting in a peace officer's presence and at his direction, even though the arrest or search is unlawful, unless the resistance is justified under Subsection (c);

(3) if the actor consented to the exact force used or attempted by the other;

(4) if the actor provoked the other's use or attempted use of unlawful force, unless:

(A) the actor abandons the encounter, or clearly communicates to the other his intent to do so reasonably believing he cannot safely abandon the encounter; and

(B) the other nevertheless continues or attempts to use unlawful force against the actor; or

(5) if the actor sought an explanation from or discussion with the other person concerning the actor's differences with the other person while the actor was:

(A) carrying a weapon in violation of Section 46.02; or

(B) possessing or transporting a weapon in violation of Section 46.05.

(c) The use of force to resist an arrest or search is justified:

(1) if, before the actor offers any resistance, the peace officer (or person acting at his direction) uses or attempts to use greater force than necessary to make the arrest or search; and

(2) when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to protect himself against the peace officer's (or other person's) use or attempted use of greater force than necessary.

(d) The use of deadly force is not justified under this subchapter except as provided in Sections 9.32, 9.33, and 9.34.

9.32. Deadly force in defense of person.

(a) A person is justified in using deadly force against another:

(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.31;

(2) if a reasonable person in the actor's situation would not have retreated; and

(3) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:

(A) to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force; or

(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery.

(b) The requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not apply to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time of the use of force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the habitation of the actor.

9.33. Defense of third person.

A person is justified in using force or deadly force against another to protect a third person if:

(1) under the circumstances as the actor reasonably believes them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.31 or 9.32 in using force or deadly force to protect himself against the unlawful force or unlawful deadly force he reasonably believes to be threatening the third person he seeks to protect; and

(2) the actor reasonably believes that his intervention is immediately necessary to protect the third person.

9.34. Protection of life or health.

(a) A person is justified in using force, but not deadly force, against another when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to prevent the other from committing suicide or inflicting serious bodily injury to himself.

(b) A person is justified in using both force and deadly force against another when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force or deadly force is immediately necessary to preserve the other's life in an emergency.

SUBCHAPTER D. PROTECTION OF PROPERTY

9.41. Protection of one's own property.

(a) A person in lawful possession of land or tangible, movable property is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to prevent or terminate the other's trespass on the land or unlawful interference with the property.

(b) A person unlawfully dispossessed of land or tangible, movable property by another is justified in using force against the other when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to reenter the land or recover the property if the actor uses the force immediately or in fresh pursuit after the dispossession and:

(1) the actor reasonably believes the other had no claim of right when he dispossessed the actor; or

(2) the other accomplished the dispossession by using force, threat, or fraud against the actor.

9.42. Deadly force to protect property.

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:

(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and

(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:

(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or

(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and

(3) he reasonably believes that:

(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or

(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.

9.43. Protection of third person's property.

A person is justified in using force or deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property of a third person if, under the circumstances as he reasonably believes them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.41 or 9.42 in using force or deadly force to protect his own land or property and:

(1) the actor reasonably believes the unlawful interference constitutes attempted or consummated theft of or criminal mischief to the tangible, movable property; or

(2) the actor reasonably believes that:

(A) the third person has requested his protection of the land or property;

(B) he has a legal duty to protect the third person's land or property; or

(C) the third person whose land or property he uses force or deadly force to protect is the actor's spouse, parent, or child, resides with the actor, or is under the actor's care.

9.44. Use of device to protect property.

The justification afforded by Sections 9.41 and 9.43 applies to the use of a device to protect land or tangible, movable property if:

(1) the device is not designed to cause, or known by the actor to create a substantial risk of causing, death or serious bodily injury; and

(2) use of the device is reasonable under all the circumstances as the actor reasonably believes them to be when he installs the device.

SUBCHAPTER E. LAW ENFORCEMENT

9.51. Arrest and search.

(a) A peace officer, or a person acting in a peace officer's presence and at his direction, is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to make or assist in making an arrest or search, or to prevent or assist in preventing escape after arrest if:

(1) the actor reasonably believes the arrest or search is lawful or, if the arrest or search is made under a warrant, he reasonably believes the warrant is valid; and

(2) before using force, the actor manifests his purpose to arrest or search and identifies himself as a peace officer or as one acting at a peace officer's direction, unless he reasonably believes his purpose and identity are already known by or cannot reasonably be made known to the person to be arrested.

(b) A person other than a peace officer (or one acting at his direction) is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to make or assist in making a lawful arrest, or to prevent or assist in preventing escape after lawful arrest if, before using force, the actor manifests his purpose to and the reason for the arrest or reasonably believes his purpose and the reason are already known by or cannot reasonably be made known to the person to be arrested.

(c) A peace officer is justified in using deadly force against another when and to the degree the peace officer reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary to make an arrest, or to prevent escape after arrest, if the use of force would have been justified under Subsection (a) and:

(1) the actor reasonably believes the conduct for which arrest is authorized included the use or attempted use of deadly force; or

(2) the actor reasonably believes there is a substantial risk that the person to be arrested will cause death or serious bodily injury to the actor or another if the arrest is delayed.

(d) A person other than a peace officer acting in a peace officer's presence and at his direction is justified in using deadly force against another when and to the degree the person reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary to make a lawful arrest, or to prevent escape after a lawful arrest, if the use of force would have been justified under Subsection (b) and:

(1) the actor reasonably believes the felony or offense against the public peace for which arrest is authorized included the use or attempted use of deadly force; or

(2) the actor reasonably believes there is a substantial risk that the person to be arrested will cause death or serious bodily injury to another if the arrest is delayed.

(e) There is no duty to retreat before using deadly force justified by Subsection (c) or (d).

(f) Nothing in this section relating to the actor's manifestation of purpose or identity shall be construed as conflicting with any other law relating to the issuance, service, and execution of an arrest or search warrant either under the laws of this state or the United States.

(g) Deadly force may only be used under the circumstances enumerated in Subsections (c) and (d).

9.52. Prevention of escape from custody.

The use of force to prevent the escape of an arrested person from custody is justifiable when the force could have been employed to effect the arrest under which the person is in custody, except that a guard employed by a correctional facility or a peace officer is justified in using any force, including deadly force, that he reasonably believes to be immediately necessary to prevent the escape of a person from the correctional facility.

9.53. Maintaining security in correctional facility.

An officer or employee of a correctional facility is justified in using force against a person in custody when and to the degree the officer or employee reasonably believes the force is necessary to maintain the security of the correctional facility, the safety or security of other persons in custody or employed by the correctional facility, or his own safety or security.

SUBCHAPTER F. SPECIAL RELATIONSHIPS

9.61. Parent - child.

(a) The use of force, but not deadly force, against a child younger than 18 years is justified:

(1) if the actor is the child's parent or stepparent or is acting in loco parentis to the child; and

(2) when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is necessary to discipline the child or to safeguard or promote his welfare.

(b) For purposes of this section, "in loco parentis" includes grandparent and guardian, any person acting by, through, or under the direction of a court with jurisdiction over the child, and anyone who has express or implied consent of the parent or parents.

9.62. Educator - student.

The use of force, but not deadly force, against a person is justified:

(1) if the actor is entrusted with the care, supervision, or administration of the person for a special purpose; and

(2) when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is necessary to further the special purpose or to maintain discipline in a group.

9.63. Guardian - incompetent.

The use of force, but not deadly force, against a mental incompetent is justified:

(1) if the actor is the incompetent's guardian or someone similarly responsible for the general care and supervision of the incompetent; and

(2) when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is necessary:

(A) to safeguard and promote the incompetent's welfare; or

(B) if the incompetent is in an institution for his care and custody, to maintain discipline in the institution.

aut cum scuto aut in scuto

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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-01-2008, 08:46 AM
hockey dominates all
 
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Location: Schaumburg, Illinois
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Location: Schaumburg, Illinois
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonely Raven View Post
*long list of legal speak*
I don't know what the point of posting that was. The "court martial" was about using a .22 instead of a .45 to make sure he killed the guy. It was more about being unprepared than shooting him, I think everyone is in agreement that shooting him was entirely justified.

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