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post #1 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:19 PM Thread Starter
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IL labor law questions

So i got a new boss at my job, he wants us to consider working 13 hour shifts, 3 days a week, with 4 days off.

personally there is no fucking way i could work 13 hours a day at this job. I told him this and he asked "what if we make it mandatory?"

theres gotta be something in the labor law forbidding company's to force you to work 13 hour shifts.

any know? or where can i look this up?

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post #2 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:21 PM
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ILDOL

If you contact them (by phone) they will answer your questions.

Where to call for answers to specific concerns:
Fair Labor Standards Division
Minimum Wage/Overtime Hotline 1-800-478-3998
Day Labor Hotline 1-877-314-7052
Day Labor Services Act 312-793-2804
One Day Rest in Seven Act 312-793-2804
Overtime 312-793-2804


FAQs: http://www.state.il.us/Agency/IDOL/FAQ/Faq.htm

Last edited by ill_ag; 03-24-2008 at 01:24 PM.
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post #3 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:24 PM
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I'm not 100% familiar with labor laws, but as long as he gives you overtime for working 5 hours over the 8 and appropriate breaks, I don't know that it is illegal.

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post #4 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:24 PM Thread Starter
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I'm not 100% familiar with labor laws, but as long as he gives you overtime for working 5 hours over the 8 and appropriate breaks, I don't know that it is illegal.
as mechanics we are not paid by clock time, therefor there is no overtime.

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post #5 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:25 PM
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not sure if your union but i think its illegal to make anything over 12 hours in one day mandatroy.

i know back at GE at that 12th hour no matter what we were doing we had to stop

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post #6 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:26 PM
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Hahahahha.

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post #7 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:28 PM
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Hahahahha.
+1

Although, anything over 12 hours requires 2 lunch breaks at 30 minutes each. I would rather do four 10 hour days. I did three 12 hour nights one time, that was hell.
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post #8 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:28 PM
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13 hour shifts eh? If I was bustin ass the whole time I'd be tired as hell! Also since you're on book time.... I'm sure you'd agree that some days are money days and some are not. For example, if you try to sell a timing belt and 30K on a Friday afternoon chances are that person won't buy it since they have to go out that night to get trashed then drive home drunk in that car. How will your SM determine who will work what days and who gets priority? Sorry to hear man but your situation sounds like the suck. And you just switched to a new place to didn't you?
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post #9 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:29 PM
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Well I don't know whether they can make your shifts that long, but you're right you aren't entitled to OT pay.


Minimum Wage Law (pertains to OT pay)
http://www.state.il.us/Agency/IDOL/FAQ/qamwot.htm
http://www.state.il.us/Agency/IDOL/laws/law105.htm

From the first link:

Who is exempt from being paid overtime?
The following employees are exempt from overtime pay:
-Salesmen and mechanics involved in selling or servicing cars, trucks or farm implements at dealerships,
-agricultural labor,
-government employees,
-executive, administrative or professional employees as defined by the Fair Labor Standards Act,
-certain employees involved in radio/television in a city with a population under 100,000,
-commissioned employees defined by Section 7(i) of the Fair Labor Standards Act,
-employees who exchange hours pursuant to a workplace exchange agreement,
-employees of certain educational or residential child care institutions.
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post #10 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mort82 View Post
+1

Although, anything over 12 hours requires 2 lunch breaks at 30 minutes each. I would rather do four 10 hour days. I did three 12 hour nights one time, that was hell.
+1, they are only required to give you a 30 minute break for each 8 hours. They are also stopping the event of overtime by having you only work 3 days/39 hours per week. So, everything looks legal, just sucks if you don't like that type of schedule or if this effects your track weekends .

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post #11 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:33 PM
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As a conductor for the railroad, we can only work for 12 hours. The big thing I see is the schedule putting a big kink in your track days.
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post #12 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:33 PM
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The only thing I could find was the "one day in seven" law. It looks like all they have give you one day off every week. As long as they give you breaks at the required times.

That is a long shift. Are you guys already on the 4/10 schedule? When I left the dealership we were there from 7am to 6pm and that sucked, I cant imagine another 2 hours.
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post #13 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:34 PM
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I think your issue would fall under the One Day Rest in Seven Act.

Provides for employees a minimum of twenty four hours of rest in each calendar week and a meal period of 20 minutes for every 7 1/2 hour shift beginning no later than 5 hours after the start of the shift. The law allows employers to secure permits from the Department to work employees the 7th day provided that the employees have voluntarily elected to work.

And it looks like there's nothing illegal about your boss' proposed shift schedule.

That doesn't mean it's not totally inane. What a f*ing idiot he is if he thinks he's going to get 13 hours of productivity out of his guys just because they are there for 13 hours.
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post #14 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:36 PM
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post #15 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:37 PM
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Well get all the techs together and tell the DEALER OWNER that if this new boss tries to implement this new "hours" everyone walks. Make sure ALL the techs from the oil guys to the body shop walk.

Honeslty I'd be looking for a different shop to work at.
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post #16 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:37 PM
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I would freaking love that schedule. I only have to work hard and long for 3 days, and the rest of the week I had off . It would only suck if the days you had to work were Fri, Sat, and Sun .

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post #17 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:38 PM
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What a f*ing idiot he is if he thinks he's going to get 13 hours of productivity out of his guys just because they are there for 13 hours.
8 hour shifts don't get more productivity either, 20 minutes is all a person can effectively handle at a time per the average person.
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post #18 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:39 PM
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Well get all the techs together and tell the DEALER OWNER that if this new boss tries to implement this new "hours" everyone walks. Make sure ALL the techs from the oil guys to the body shop walk.
That would be great if it actually worked. I've personally never heard of everyone walking out. About 2/3 is the most I've heard and even that still worked especially if you do when they need you most. It's damn difficult to get everyone to agree though.
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post #19 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:39 PM
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Good mechanics will book more hours than they are there in a good shop. Bring up safety as a factor. Fatigue and heavy equiptment make for a dangerous combination. In our rulebook for the railroad, we are allowed to nap while on duty. True story.
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post #20 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:46 PM
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Good mechanics will book more hours than they are there in a good shop.
Yes but that doesn't mean they WORK more hours. All that it means is that the mechanic is productive and can do a two hour job in, for example, one hour. That doesn't equate to that same mechanic being able to retain that rate of productivity over 13 clock hours.

Alex's shop isn't asking him to book 13 hours in a day-- he does that routinely anyway-- they are asking him to physcially be present and working for 13 hours. Totally different. Actually, Alex stands to lose money this way because assuming the same number of clock hours per week as before, having to do them in 13 hour batches might make him less productive and thus equal less book hours per clock hours than under the previous model, thus less take-home pay.

No model for shift work is inherently right or wrong; all I am saying is that your boss is a fool if he's assuming a straight line correlation between labor hours input and completed work output. Further, he's a fool if he's even "guessing" about the effectiveness of this plan. One thing remains true in all businesses, and that's that you can't piss off your employees.

Last edited by ill_ag; 03-24-2008 at 01:50 PM.
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post #21 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:47 PM
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Are the 3 days like Monday- Tuesday- Wednesday or are they spread out? I don't think that's all that bad, I think it would take some time to get use to it... but having 4 days off would be nice. Although I know you can't really sit still and get bored easily. Hey, this way you can maybe get more track days in? I dunno...
He also said "what if" it's not definite yet.

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post #22 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ill_ag View Post
Well I don't know whether they can make your shifts that long, but you're right you aren't entitled to OT pay.


Minimum Wage Law (pertains to OT pay)
http://www.state.il.us/Agency/IDOL/FAQ/qamwot.htm
http://www.state.il.us/Agency/IDOL/laws/law105.htm

From the first link:

Who is exempt from being paid overtime?
The following employees are exempt from overtime pay:
-Salesmen and mechanics involved in selling or servicing cars, trucks or farm implements at dealerships,
-agricultural labor,
-government employees,
-executive, administrative or professional employees as defined by the Fair Labor Standards Act,
-certain employees involved in radio/television in a city with a population under 100,000,
-commissioned employees defined by Section 7(i) of the Fair Labor Standards Act,
-employees who exchange hours pursuant to a workplace exchange agreement,
-employees of certain educational or residential child care institutions.


I wish those rules applied for Federal Employees But they dont

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post #23 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:50 PM
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I would love that schedule. I can't imagine however that it would be illegal considering that fireman many times are on 24 or 48 hours at a time (as an example).

It would seem to me that if you are union, they'd have something to say.
Also, there might be an issue for them CHANGING what you were hired for with out adequate notice.

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post #24 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:52 PM
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I wish those rules applied for Federal Employees But they dont
NO they just give you the blanket "sorry-- not you guys!"
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post #25 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:52 PM
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If the three days are in a row during the week, I would not have a problem with this. Think of all the time saved not going, getting ready or cleaning up from work.

I have no idea how intense the job and I'm not in your shoes. I would love to be off the clock four full days a week. Many people ask for 10 hrs/4day work days to get the three days off. Maybe that would be a good compromise. I prefer the three.
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post #26 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:52 PM
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Tell them you'll do it if they pay your health insurance. With that number of hours fatige will set in, and you'll start making more mistakes. There by costing the company more cash.

Now when the company goes back to 8 hour shifts, your health insurance is still paid.

Win - Win.

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post #27 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:54 PM
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4 days off a week!!!

That would be sweet but I'd waste so much money with that many off days. I couldn't do that because I'm a dad and 13 hours just wouldn't work.

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post #28 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:55 PM
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Tell them you'll do it if they pay your health insurance. With that number of hours fatige will set in, and you'll start making more mistakes. There by costing the company more cash.

Now when the company goes back to 8 hour shifts, your health insurance is still paid.

Win - Win.
That will never work...
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post #29 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:55 PM
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Its not illegal. The guys in the office next to mine who man our Ops Center work 3 12 hour days and then come in one other day for 4 hours. They like it.

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post #30 of 86 (permalink) Old 03-24-2008, 01:57 PM
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Ill_ag, re read my post. I understand how actual hours and book hours work. My last job before the railroad was working as a service manager.
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