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post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 05:26 PM Thread Starter
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F`n citibank

government bails them out and they turn around and spend 400million to keep their name on the new mets stadium.

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post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 05:32 PM
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post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:07 PM
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GM wisely dropped the endorsement deal they had with Tiger Woods.
Did the execs fly in their private jets to his house on GM's dime?
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post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:12 PM
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Numerous other places have gotten bailouts and have done similar things. Get money and throw a huge part in vegas for all the managment.

I'm curious though if citibank goes under do I have to pay back my credit card?

You wanna see my itinerary?
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post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:18 PM
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I'm curious though if citibank goes under do I have to pay back my credit card?
Or my Mortgage ????

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post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:23 PM
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It's interesting how banks look at it. I was talking about the whole situation with my friend who works for a large bank and mentioned how banks blew it by not doing proper due diligence on loans/mortgages and not having enough risk management. His response was: "WTF?! It's the *customers* who do not stick to their end of the contractual agreement by not paying back what they're supposed to!". I think he has a point... even though I believe it is bank's responsibility to manage risks. Meaning that if one customer doesn't pay - it's customer's fault. But if a bank goes under because it gave away loans to people who can't possibly pay, it's banks fault.

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post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:24 PM
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Or my Mortgage ????
Yes... Debt is an asset to a bank and someone would acquire it. If Citibank "once the largest financial institution" went under, we would have some serious problems.

Citi did not sign up for the Mets stadium today. It has been in place since 2006 and paid over 20 years. Citi was worth around 500 billion at the time, just before all this garbage started.




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post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:34 PM
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It's interesting how banks look at it. I was talking about the whole situation with my friend who works for a large bank and mentioned how banks blew it by not doing proper due diligence on loans/mortgages and not having enough risk management. His response was: "WTF?! It's the *customers* who do not stick to their end of the contractual agreement by not paying back what they're supposed to!". I think he has a point... even though I believe it is bank's responsibility to manage risks. Meaning that if one customer doesn't pay - it's customer's fault. But if a bank goes under because it gave away loans to people who can't possibly pay, it's banks fault.
Due diligence.. pfft.. Freddie and Fannie set the standards. Not to mention the major push for sub prime by our government. Citi has too much exposure to the U.S. real estate market, pure and simple.




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post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:34 PM
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As a marketing & advertising guy, statically successful companies spend more on advertising during a recession. It's a great way to grab more market share if your competitors are having a tougher time than you.

Names on ball parks these days may not be the best investment. I'm also sure that deal was signed quite some time ago. It could be almost as expensive to back out of it.

I just heard Nissan, Mitsubishi, and another car maker are pulling out of the Detroit & Chicago car shows. I hope that decision bites them in the a#$. It's hard to get people in your showroom if you don't get them excited about your products.

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post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:51 PM
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Due diligence.. pfft.. Freddie and Fannie set the standards. Not to mention the major push for sub prime by our government. Citi has too much exposure to the U.S. real estate market, pure and simple.
Guess so... I forgot to add a disclaimer: I don't know shit about finances. Just common sense. But, it is well known that common sense and business often don't mix.

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post #11 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 06:52 PM
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Due diligence.. pfft.. Freddie and Fannie set the standards. Not to mention the major push for sub prime by our government. Citi has too much exposure to the U.S. real estate market, pure and simple.
Strong companies don't take a crap without doing due diligence.

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post #12 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 07:00 PM
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Strong companies don't take a crap without doing due diligence.
The only banks doing well right now are those without a mortgage portfolio. Tie in Citi's large credit card market share and...... I'm just saying, this has more to do than due diligence when it comes to credit markets.

Solid business models from a few years ago with tons of profit are tanking now.




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post #13 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 07:17 PM
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So if they go under what happens to my mortgage. cause I want it to be dissolved and the title to my house sent to me. if thats the result of them going under I vote for letting them fail.




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post #14 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 07:26 PM
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Keep dreaming HDT. As stated numerous times, someone will buy your debt.

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post #15 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 07:28 PM
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They need to not let that happen imagine how the economy would flourish if citi went under and all those mortgages were whips out. It would be one hell of a stimulus package. I know I'd be out buying a Porsche the next day




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post #16 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 07:31 PM
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They need to not let that happen imagine how the economy would flourish if citi went under and all those mortgages were whips out. It would be one hell of a stimulus package. I know I'd be out buying a Porsche the next day
Yeah.... but my mortgage is not with Citi so that sucks!

and if Citi went under you better have cash for the Porsche cause I think loans for exotic cars might be hard to come by..




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post #17 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 08:03 PM
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The only banks doing well right now are those without a mortgage portfolio. Tie in Citi's large credit card market share and...... I'm just saying, this has more to do than due diligence when it comes to credit markets.

Solid business models from a few years ago with tons of profit are tanking now.
Many businesses that have products/services designed to cut costs are actually up...because people are now beating down their doors to find less expensive ways to do the same things.

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post #18 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 08:04 PM
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Keep dreaming HDT. As stated numerous times, someone will buy your debt.
Yup... someone might pay pennies on the dollar for the debt instrument (your mortgage) but you'll still, luckily, owe the full amount....guaranteeing them a nice profit...unless you default.

Sucks, huh?

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post #19 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-24-2008, 08:20 PM
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Many businesses that have products/services designed to cut costs are actually up...because people are now beating down their doors to find less expensive ways to do the same things.
Yes but so many are down or going out. Look at the commercial real estate market. Measures over the years to plug leaks in the dam.

Less expensive ways usually leads to one thing, personal. After that you could factor in technology. This recession will be here for a while. We're all out of options but to ride it out.

One huge problem is we do not build anything anymore, especially goods that are exported. We also outsource low to moderate income jobs overseas. Look at the big three, how long were they going to survive building vehicles that only appeal to the U.S.?

Here is where the bank's got stupid. No doc programs, interest only 1st mortgages and 125% LTV HELOC's. These loans pale in comparison to sub-prime and anyone doing loans in Florida, CA & Nevada.




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post #20 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-25-2008, 02:44 PM Thread Starter
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maybe it woulda cost citi more to pull out of the ball park deal. dunno. but it was mentioned on the news clip that they figured the advertising was going to do them well. maybe maybe not eh? but using bailout money in such a way, to me, seems like a waste when they also plan on cutting massive jobs. the number, however, eludes my aging arse

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post #21 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-25-2008, 04:08 PM
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Advertising is a one of those mysterious concepts, I do not believe you can truely quantifiy the return on investment. For example Apple, they have a ton of commercials for the iphone, do you really believe they need them? The hype about that thing was huge. Maybe pre release but now? I don't know, it just seems like on an itme like that people will buy it with or without advertising.

As far as Citi, as already stated, if they are in a long term contract, it would cost them more to bail out of it.

Just my 2 cents,
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post #22 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-25-2008, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arch View Post
Yup... someone might pay pennies on the dollar for the debt instrument (your mortgage) but you'll still, luckily, owe the full amount....guaranteeing them a nice profit...unless you default.

Sucks, huh?

Why doesn't somebody come up with an alternative game plan. If Citi (or any other bank for that matter) defaults, my mortgage (Citi's assest) would be purchased by somebody else. If all of the mortgage'ee's were to purchase up there own loans, if you consider it to be 80 cents on the dollar, that means I would get a 20% discount on the amount owe'd, I wouldn't be in the red on my mortgage, so other companies would be likely to borrow me money. My mortgage would go down, hence that money would be available to introduce money that money into the economy. Now, Citibank isn't going to go through the hassle of selling mortgages one at a time as it would be an administrative nightmare. Instead they would have to bulk sell them to a holding company that would offer a bridge service, they charge a fee to renegotiate my mortgage.

Because the prices would be down, foreclosures would be down. you would be influxing the cash into the economy, Citi bank would dissolve, and the government could serve an example to other companies that we will help the consumer directly and bad business practices (or short sited ones) will not be "okay"

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post #23 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-25-2008, 04:42 PM
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Theres alot more too it than this thread suggest if I understand correctly. First, "bailout" is not a great term. It was a purchase of preferred stock and a loan guarantee. To be precise, it's more of an investment in the firm. Second, Citigroups deal with the Mets is a partnership. I believe they get an ownership in the team as well as get to keep their name on the stadium. That's an ingenious way to spend ad $'s and possibly get a return on it IMO.

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post #24 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-25-2008, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
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Yup... someone might pay pennies on the dollar for the debt instrument (your mortgage) but you'll still, luckily, owe the full amount....guaranteeing them a nice profit...unless you default.

Sucks, huh?

OK...lets be fair. Someone might pay pennies on the dollar for a portfolio full of mortgages. While you may pay your mortgage the other people may not. Making the portfolio only worth as much as what you pay. That means their is still risk in the security and may not even be a return on the portfolio even if you pay your mortgage. You guys are trying to make this simple. It's not!!!! which unfortunately is part of the problem to begin with

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post #25 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 11:25 AM Thread Starter
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Theres alot more too it than this thread suggest if I understand correctly. First, "bailout" is not a great term. It was a purchase of preferred stock and a loan guarantee. To be precise, it's more of an investment in the firm. Second, Citigroups deal with the Mets is a partnership. I believe they get an ownership in the team as well as get to keep their name on the stadium. That's an ingenious way to spend ad $'s and possibly get a return on it IMO.

now i relly didn`t think about the size of the return they would be getting for having the name on the stadium. it could be qyite profitable enough to really help them out. but it does still seem like an arogant venture at first glance. and msnbc made it seem that way also

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