“Backin it In?” - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:00 PM Thread Starter
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“Backin it In?”

Okay, so I’m ignorant, I’ll admit it.

What does “backing it in” mean? And could someone explain the process?

I am in no way, planning on learning to do this. I’m just asking, for knowledge sake.

Thanks.

Ken.


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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:00 PM
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Watch the rear end of the bike swing wide as they come into a turn at blazing speeds, giggling like an insane person




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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:03 PM
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Nicky Hayden does this a lot.

Never a bad time to climb... unless the weather is really horrible, and then you climb inside!

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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:06 PM
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Do a search for the MotoGP vids that have been posted, it is very apparent on some of those clips

"When in doubt, use full throttle. It may not improve your situation, but it will end the suspense."
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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:07 PM Thread Starter
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Okay, I've them slide the rear around on the enterance to a corner.
But how do they get it initiated?

Ken.


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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scout67
Okay, I've them slide the rear around on the enterance to a corner.
But how do they get it initiated?
By hauling ass! Insane entry speed and braking..............

"When in doubt, use full throttle. It may not improve your situation, but it will end the suspense."

Last edited by Kegger; 03-15-2006 at 12:12 PM.
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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:13 PM
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From what i understand its all about the front braking force making the rear end light. but I am no expert.




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Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:13 PM
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Kinda like 'drifting' on a bike. Except not the same. lol

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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:14 PM
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Lots of practice:

Twist of wrist
Braking
Push 7 pull of bars
Push and pull of footpegs
Your hip & body placement

Take one of Ken's riding classes when he gives it, you'll learn basics and he can go into advanced racing stuff too....

Read alot also, can help ya....

Good Luck do not try at home.... Do some track days Nesba
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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:17 PM
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Just before your turn in point, engage the clutch. Shift into reverse. Feather out the clutch.

You, and whatever's left of your bike will initiate a controlled slide into happyness!



(and if Ken's teaching people how to back it in at his classes - sign me up! )

<---- Patrick

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post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Underdog
(and if Ken's teaching people how to back it in at his classes - sign me up! )
Me too, I wanna learn too!

"When in doubt, use full throttle. It may not improve your situation, but it will end the suspense."
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post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:22 PM
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yeah, i thought it was when your parking at strats and you put your bike in neutral and back it up to the curb... isn't taht backing it in? if im right, your free to try it in your garage or at the first strats event

<-- Chris

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post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:22 PM
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There is a certian amount of rear brake application involved, too. Have a look at the shot of Doohan in the opening scene of FASTER... Or any footage of Gary McCoy, for that matter.

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post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:27 PM
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Rear brake is optional....most dont need it. Backing it in allows them to square the corner off better/faster and be pointed in the right corner exit direction.
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post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Underdog
Just before your turn in point, engage the clutch. Shift into reverse. Feather out the clutch.

You, and whatever's left of your bike will initiate a controlled slide into happyness!



(and if Ken's teaching people how to back it in at his classes - sign me up! )
Thats exactly how Ken is teaching it, but he's the only one that has reverse.




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Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

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post #16 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 12:29 PM
 
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It's not something so much you teach. The basicis of doing it have been said. It's more of a learned thing from lap after lap. Most guys that are good and comfortable with it have a big dirt background. It's about the ass end loosing traction from excessive braking or alot of throttle. Or both!

Not to be tried on the street. Save the practice for the track. Honestly, you'll get the back end out trying to stay with someone faster while really pushing your skills and bike to the limit. It will happen a little bit and you'll react by thinking - Holly sh!t! The back just stepped out and I was in complete controll!!!! Can't wait for that to happen again!
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post #17 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 07:47 PM
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backing it in mini xr100 style


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post #18 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 08:15 PM
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Remeber doing rear wheel hook-skids on your bicycle ? Same thing.

Only difference is you are using the rear brake or engine braking to skid the rear slightly - not lock it up completely.


As you are approaching the corner and braking hard, pull in the clutch and bang a downshift or two and then feather the clutch out... the braking force from the engine skids the rear enough for it to step out.

Fuck this up and the last thing you will say before impact is

" HEY ! I can see my house from up here !"

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post #19 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 08:30 PM
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Tap the rear brake and control the slide with the gas.

"I pity the poor people who don't ride motorcycles"
-Malcolm Smith, champion motorcycle racer

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post #20 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-15-2006, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLARNEY
Remeber doing rear wheel hook-skids on your bicycle ? Same thing.

Only difference is you are using the rear brake or engine braking to skid the rear slightly - not lock it up completely.


As you are approaching the corner and braking hard, pull in the clutch and bang a downshift or two and then feather the clutch out... the braking force from the engine skids the rear enough for it to step out.

Fuck this up and the last thing you will say before impact is

" HEY ! I can see my house from up here !"
Yeah man, I be doing this soon! I always wanted to see my house from Rockford! Or Joliet!! Elkhart Lake!!! The sky's the limit!

NESBA #95 A
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post #21 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-16-2006, 12:23 PM
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Jeff Haney was doing some real impressive "backin it in" when we were in vegas coupla months ago. Came around me at the speed of sound and backed it in right in front of me.

They showed us how to do it and it was simply hitting the rear brake and sliding the rear end around as you go into the turn.

We did some rear braking drills but I am not too big a fan of it at this point in my own personal development.

And from the looks of the guys who do it verses the guys who do not, it doesn't really seem to make you neccessarily faster.

I will say this though,

IT IS SPECTACULAR TO WATCH UP CLOSE IN PERSON and if you get it right ... it makes you look pretty cool. Of course, if you get it wrong...

Ron Hix
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post #22 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-16-2006, 12:39 PM
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i dont teach backing it in/squaring off corners with the rear.

i can barely do it myself, and dont feel comfortable with it.

the only thing i do feel comfortable with is exiting while spining up the rear to hook my rear over more to shift my foward direction faster.


my way of backing it in is.

"1 you have to be going at a race pace entry, not pussy footing around engine breaking"

throttle pinned heading towards T1, you know your breaking zone from the 100 times of praticing how deep can you get.

apply then break fully with the front while down shifting altogether, this starts the back end to get light and will drift, when you start to roll the front wheel over to lean it, once the rear is backing out shifting the front faster into the direction you went for, apply some gas get threw the corner as fast as possible, stand it back up fast as possible, and nail the fucken throttle.

repeat only when needed.


this is not something someone should be trying, when you have minor or medium skills even at a track level.

you will and very well can land on your head.

the only way i think a person gets comfortable with this is when they learn how to modulate traction "the point where it is breaking loose and your doing a controled slide in or out. once you become old mary rotten crotch with that, time to push it some more.


just remember pain hurts.



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post #23 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-16-2006, 01:00 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scout67
Okay, so I’m ignorant, I’ll admit it.

What does “backing it in” mean? And could someone explain the process?

I am in no way, planning on learning to do this. I’m just asking, for knowledge sake.

Thanks.
Again this is only for understanding sake!

Thanks everyone for the info.

Ken.


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post #24 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-16-2006, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emoor
Yeah man, I be doing this soon! I always wanted to see my house from Rockford! Or Joliet!! Elkhart Lake!!! The sky's the limit!

House, forget the house, I'm going to the moon.

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post #25 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 10:47 AM
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You need to ride in the dirt to figure out this concept. Trying to learn this on pavement WILL send you over the bars and into the trees.

Go to the AMA races in Elkart Lake the first weekend of June. The best place to get a great example of Road Racers 'Backing it in" is at the entrance of Turn 5.

Watch the guys come into turn 5 hard on the brakes while the back end of the bike is really lite and its wagging back and forth. No shit! They wag their tails going into that corner. Some use a little rear brake action to pitch it side ways and crank it into the hard 90 degree turn (Turn 5)

Pretty Sweet to watch!

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post #26 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 11:34 AM
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Go to American Supercamp!

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post #27 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blade Runner
Go to American Supercamp!

http://www.americansupercamp.com/

Thats a good post (rep points sent).

If you have the 600 bucks you will know how to "Back it in" after you take this class.

You will also ride so much you won't be able to ride your motorcycle at the end of the day.

"I pity the poor people who don't ride motorcycles"
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post #28 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 11:40 AM
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BTW, like others have said.

Don't do/learn this on the street!

There is nothing firm, nothing balanced, nothing durable in all the universe. Nothing remains in its original state, each day, each hour, each moment, there is change. Change is the essence of life. Embrace change as you do life. To fight change is to live in the past.
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post #29 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-24-2006, 02:40 PM
 
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The one thing that seems to get lost is "Bike setup" !!!! The rear will come around and swap sides different depending on your suspension setup.

Rear Brake and engine branking makes a big difference as well. Slipper clutches help this tendency a ton and allows you to turn in when you want not when you can!!

If you aren't trail braking and do most of your braking straight up and down you can get the rear end swapping back and forth side to side. It isn't a problem just ignore it and ride throught it. Like I said it depends on setup and engine branking. You can slow it down with rear brake but modifing your setup would be a much better option.

I rarely use my rear brake. Mostly to stop chatter and wheelie issues.

Just my 2 cents.

Sean
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post #30 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-24-2006, 02:49 PM
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Backing it in Road Racing and Backing it in Flat Track and Supermoto style can be pretty different.

But, they are the same in a lot of ways. If you want to back it in on a road racing machine like Nicky Hayden a tap on the rear brake is a must. I remember before Nicky went to Moto Gp, he was smoking rear brakes on the RC51.

A slipper clutch is a luxiary. Learning to blip the throttle and match your RPMs with your down shifts is Key.

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