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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 11:35 PM Thread Starter
 
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i wanna do a riding school

but whats available out there? how much does one usually cost?

im assuming a person learns more at a school than the equivalent money spent on track days, is this true?
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 11:39 PM
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yeah, a school would be kick-arse! i remember a thread about someone who went to racing school with an ex-racer and had them give them a walk around of the track and pointing out lines and apexes/braking points, then followed them when riding and i think they even had chatterbox things to talk to them and tip them while riding....i'll look around to see if i can find it..

- Steve
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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 11:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chach
but whats available out there? how much does one usually cost?

im assuming a person learns more at a school than the equivalent money spent on track days, is this true?
That all depends on the school and the track day organization you choose to ride with. Many of the NESBA CRs are current and/or past AMA Pro racers, tons of current WERA and CCS racers as well. Many of the CRs have also attended a variety of schools, as well as have many of the NESBA loyal members.

Translation, you can learn as much at NESBA as you want. All you need to do is ask.

However, some schools provide a more targeted training environment, with the potential for more feedback. Prices range from $200-$350 a day (bring your own bike) to around a $1000 a day (they provide bike, tires, etc...)

It is all up to your budget. If you want the best, go to Freddie Spencer's High Performance Riding School. Locally, STAR school is one of the best, and is far cheaper, and you ride your own bike on a track you might race on or do track days on. It all depends on what you are looking for.

BTW, Freddie's schools are excellent. They also use Chatterboxes to communicate and give immediate feedback.

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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 11:47 PM
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i think i'm going to try that next season...the STAR thing that is

That way i'll be more or less ready for track and start advancing my skills quickly!

- Steve

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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-04-2006, 11:54 PM
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Steve,

You haven't even done a track day yet. Save your money, and spend some time on track days first. There is much to learn just starting out before the input from a school will do you much, if any good at all IMHO.

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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:02 AM
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Has anyone done the Ride Chicago advanced class???? I was just thinking about getting in an advanced class to get faster. Wondering if its any good. Only $105 for the advanced class.

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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:04 AM
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hmm...ok, wasn't sure which would help faster

- Steve
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:04 AM
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And how do you get your CLSB discount from them?

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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:04 AM
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riding school

I wish THERE WERE RIDING SCHOOLS AROUND HERE THAT WERE A LITTLE BETTER STRUCTURED ,LIKE FOLLWING YOU WITH A MOVIE CAM TO SHOW YOU HOW SLOPPY YOU CAN BE ECT,ECT,ECT, I WENT TO ONE SCHOOL ALLS THEY DID WAS CHALK YOUR LINES OR SET YOUR MARKS WHICH HELP , THERE'S NOTHING LIKE A MIRROR IMAGE ,LIKE A BOXER USES, THAT WAY YOU REALLY KNOW WHAT YOU HAVE TO WORK ON ,EVEN THE BEING COACHED IS ALSO GREAT BUT TOGETHER ITS LIKE THE NFL AND POP WARNER
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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:18 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wink
Translation, you can learn as much at NESBA as you want. All you need to do is ask.
what do you think is keeping me from being faster?
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chach
what do you think is keeping me from being faster?
you gotta ask the CR right after your session.

"When in doubt, use full throttle. It may not improve your situation, but it will end the suspense."
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c.b.
I wish THERE WERE RIDING SCHOOLS AROUND HERE THAT WERE A LITTLE BETTER STRUCTURED ,LIKE FOLLWING YOU WITH A MOVIE CAM TO SHOW YOU HOW SLOPPY YOU CAN BE ECT,ECT,ECT, I WENT TO ONE SCHOOL ALLS THEY DID WAS CHALK YOUR LINES OR SET YOUR MARKS WHICH HELP , THERE'S NOTHING LIKE A MIRROR IMAGE ,LIKE A BOXER USES, THAT WAY YOU REALLY KNOW WHAT YOU HAVE TO WORK ON ,EVEN THE BEING COACHED IS ALSO GREAT BUT TOGETHER ITS LIKE THE NFL AND POP WARNER
I video people every weekend. I'd be happy to video you next weekend if you'd like.

Check out:

Autobahn Videos

Blackhawk Videos

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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chach
what do you think is keeping me from being faster?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kegger
you gotta ask the CR right after your session.

Chach,

I think I have told you before exactly what you need to focus on. Line and form. Line and form. You have improved significantly since Autobahn North, you did a great job at Blackhawk this weekend. You looked clean, under control, with good line and form. Now all you need is to pick up the gas faster, brake later, and carry more corner speed.

Those are things that we all work on. As Greg Kotlin said in one of his posts, he works on one corner at a time, one skill at a time, until each becomes second nature. Then at some point, it clicks.

There is also quite a bit of brain involved in riding clean and fast. I think that you just need more time on the track. Don't get me wrong, you are at the level where a school could also do you some good, but I think that you are progressing very well already. Have you reviewed your video more than a few times?

Are you reading riding books? Studying track maps? Determining how to break down a track into sections? Do you have a plan for each corner and gear before you get to the track?

Anyhow, all those things would help. If you want to read, I strongly recommend Nick Ienatsch's book, Sport Riding Techniques. A close second is Total Control, by Lee Parks.

Hope that helps,

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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stilltopdawg33
Has anyone done the Ride Chicago advanced class???? I was just thinking about getting in an advanced class to get faster. Wondering if its any good. Only $105 for the advanced class.

I have it is great but it is not a track school it really just teaches you how to control your bike. All of this can be related to the track especially trail braking.

for a track school I have heard a lot of good things about learning curves.

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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:37 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wink
There is also quite a bit of brain involved in riding clean and fast.
yeah that is a good argument for more track time

thinking about it some more, i think with new tires i can trust i can remove a bit more of that mental block
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post #16 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:43 PM
 
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I work at a beginner and advanced course. Its usually $275. The racing courses i dont really know anything about, but i heard there a blast. Or you can read a racing book and try to practice what you read if you understand it.

Last edited by honda978; 09-05-2006 at 02:45 PM.
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post #17 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:47 PM
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I have heard that Supercamp is the best riding school you can take. It's a flat track school but the skills cross over to any kind of riding. They base a lof of the skills on playing with lack of traction, body positioning, and throttle control. Buying a dirtbike and riding consistantly will help your Road Racing/Street Bike skills ten fold.

I am in no way bullshiting. A dirtbike will help your road racing skill BIG TIME!

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post #18 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 02:58 PM
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American Supercamp is a hoot, you learn quite a bit. people think the price is steep, but it's two days of riding somebody else's bike. You can crash all you want, as long as it's not intentional they don't care. And the only way to make it more fun is to take away the family aspect and start having pR0n stars as guest speakers. While that would be fun, Nicky Hayden, Chris Carr, Eboz all know a bit more about backing a MOTORCYCLE in than Jenna or Janine.

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post #19 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:11 PM
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Become a proficient street rider first: MSF Beginner and Advanced.

Then, do some track days.

If you want to take it to the next level, think Visionsports, or Code/Pridmore/pick your flavor. VRS will qualify you to purchase a CCS racing license.

Learning Curves will also qualify you to purchase a CCS racing license, but since that is their primary focus, you may not get all that you want out of the program (track time is extremely limited).

The Cadillac of roadracing schools is Spencer.

And I'd also strongly recommend Supercamp, but only AFTER you've gotten some dirt experience - and AFTER you've gotten some racing/track day experience.

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post #20 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:23 PM
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Pridmore's school always got good reviews, loads of track time people said:

http://www.starmotorcycle.com/

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post #21 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:24 PM
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Good post Kimmy. Her progression is probably what you have in mind and is pretty good. You won't get much out of a roadracing school until you get some track time in. Bang for the buck-wise, Visionsports and STAR are pretty good.

You don't NEED dirt experience to do supercamp, but it helps a lot since you know why you can't grab a fistful of front brake. They also now provide gear if you don't have any. I wasn't trying hard enough when I went there..I never crashed!

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post #22 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:27 PM
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wINK CAM MAN

Next time I head to the track I'd like to take you up on the cam, I know this will help me see all my mistakes which I no I need a lot of improving.thanks Dave
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post #23 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grover
You don't NEED dirt experience to do supercamp, but it helps a lot since you know why you can't grab a fistful of front brake.
i know why firsthand
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post #24 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c.b.
Next time I head to the track I'd like to take you up on the cam, I know this will help me see all my mistakes which I no I need a lot of improving.thanks Dave
Happy to help Dave.

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post #25 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chach
i know why firsthand
Chach learned that lesson once all too well in T6 at Autobahn North (right in front of me). I don't think he'll be making that mistake again anytime soon.

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post #26 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wink
Chach learned that lesson once all too well in T6 at Autobahn North (right in front of me). I don't think he'll be making that mistake again anytime soon.
In regards to off road excursions, off roading will help in that regard. Just having the knowledge/experience to NOT hit the front brake is key. Best way to do that is to do intentional off road trips. Since GSXRs, R6s, SVs, and ZXs make lousy off road bikes, it's better to practice on YZs, RMs, CRs, and KXs. Plus, making a 50 foot black streak on the concrete with the dirtbike while locking up the rear is fun.

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post #27 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-05-2006, 09:37 PM

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wink

Are you reading riding books? Studying track maps? Determining how to break down a track into sections? Do you have a plan for each corner and gear before you get to the track?

Anyhow, all those things would help. If you want to read, I strongly recommend Nick Ienatsch's book, Sport Riding Techniques. A close second is Total Control, by Lee Parks.

Hope that helps,
I agree with Wink that there is plenty to be learned from the Nesba CR's. We have something like 8 AMA licensed pro racers in the midwest alone.

You can't go wrong with a good school I would guess. But before I drop that money, I want the basics to be second nature so I can concentrate on their suggestions at a school.

I read the Reg Pridmore book. "Smooth riding the Pridmore way" It really seemed like a good starter book. Lots of basic information in there. Then I'd read Keith Codes book "Twist of the wrist" and the sequel. They get you into the mind of a racer. Some of his analogies are unique, but he makes his point. I liked the second much better than the first, but you understand his logic better in the second if you read the first one. I'm now reading Sporbike performance handbook. It's really in depth on the technology thats in our bikes. I'm a technical guy, so I get the most out of things when I understand how they work. I figure even if I can't do all the tuning myself, if I understand whats in there and how it works, I can better communicate to a pro what I'm thinking and what I'm looking for. We'll see how that logic works out someday when I have the skills to know what the bike is telling me.

One thing that I don't do enough of is track walks. Sounds kinda dumb but it really helps. Look from the straight to each corner. Study the dips and pavement iregularities. Stop at each corners entrance and exit. Look forward throught the corner and look backward as well. You may not ride the corner backward (hopefully), but you may notice something you didn't see from the other angle. Study the track maps and overhead views and look for basic lines. I've heard of racers going out and walking for hours. Even laying on the pavement studying dips and camber changes. Sometimes I'll find a quiet place and run the track in my mind. I'll recreate a lap in my mind. Where I'm looking, what I'm planning, where I'm shifting, when I'm braking etc. I'd have to imagine if you did this correctly in your mind the time it takes you to do the lap in your head should be very close to your actual lap time. Sounds kinda dorky, but I do this when I'm trying to fall asleep each night before I go to a track I've visited before.

Watching track videos do very little for me. I'm just a hands on kinda person.

I've heard nothing but good things about the Super Dave schools from AMA & CCS racers as well as Nesba riders. I believe it's Vision sports as previously posted. He's on the CCS boards constantly if you want to find him. He helps you setup your suspension and gives lots of on track evaluation I'm told.

I've heard good things about the Pridmore star racing schools. Wink has good information on schools as well.

Since I just can't seem to shut up tonight, I'll add one last thing. Bike setup! If you want to track ride seriously, setup the bike for the track. Get the sag set front and rear. You may eventually need springs as well. Many people over look their springs. Springs can make a HUGE difference in a bike. The right springs put your suspension in it's sweet spot for best feedback. It reduces the time it takes the bike to change directions or react to steering inputs. And much more. Adjust your levers so your wrists are at the correct angles. This will help you feel comfortable and reduce fatigue and joint stress. Adjust your rearsets if they're adjustable. Adjust the brake and shift lever as well. Set them up so they work best for you.

Maybe we should create and sticky a "So you want to ride on the track" thread? Make it a Faq for this kind of information?

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