Laying down a Darky??? - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 11:35 AM Thread Starter
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Laying down a Darky???

So is that faint line of rubber connected to my rear pilot power?



I thought darkies were only left by really fast riders but I noticed more than one person in *I* group leaving them as I trailed them off that same turn towards ACC North's front straight...that turn is covered.

Thoughts? Don't hesitate to burst my bubble

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post #2 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 11:36 AM
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darkies???? that's racist!
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post #3 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 11:39 AM
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yeah I was expecting something srsly racist.
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post #4 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 11:48 AM
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post #5 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 12:25 PM
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post #6 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 12:33 PM
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post #7 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 12:34 PM
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well , rear tire wears out and that must leave a trail. If that's what you'r asking. Also you may have rear end sliding a bit. I don't see how that comming into picture considering your lean angle is about 45-46 where PP allows for 50 (read , you can go %10 faster through the same turn.) So that's said , I'd look into rear rebound and see if that helps reducing the slippage.

In my case, it did when rear rebound slowed comparing to what the rebound force was before.

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post #8 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 12:58 PM Thread Starter
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it's a motorcycle forum people! "Darky" isn't one I hear that much (in your context)...

DieselBoy, thanks. I didn't notice my rear slipping at all but I've got a new rear shock on there that might need some more rebound/comp adjustment. I'd go faster if my skills/confidence allowed...little by little.

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post #9 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DefyInertia View Post
it's a motorcycle forum people! "Darky" isn't one I hear that much (in your context)...

DieselBoy, thanks. I didn't notice my rear slipping at all but I've got a new rear shock on there that might need some more rebound/comp adjustment. I'd go faster if my skills/confidence allowed...little by little.
Hey who took that picture.....I'm looking to see if anyone got pictures of me on my new trackbike
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post #10 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:05 PM
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you've still got a pretty good size contact patch on the ground in that pic, at least 2x the width of the mark. I would guess it's from another bike.
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post #11 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:09 PM
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you've still got a pretty good size contact patch on the ground in that pic, at least 2x the width of the mark. I would guess it's from another bike.

Werd ....driving over fast guys "darkies" form the previous session does not count!

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post #12 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:10 PM
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Looks to me like the tire is doing just what it suppose to be doing.

To answer your question, I see darky's all the time (I also see dead people, but that is another story).

Seriously, once your pace gets to a place where the tires are really working then you will start to see that. You will see it more with a race tire because they are softer and will leave more rubber on the track. But, the PP has a soft side as well and will leave them.

When you hear people say "the track is green", what they mean is that it doesn't have a lot of rubber laid down on the race line. This is where the best traction comes from, rubber on the track against rubber on the tire.

For example, this past weekend while I was racing I could clearly see thick darky's from the sides of the tires in the T3 carousel at HPT. As the bike leaned over further and further, the darky's would get thinner and thinner as there was less of a contact patch.

So it is not just off the rear tire during drives, it also happens off of the side of the tire. BUT, you have to be working the tire hard enough to cause some "scrubbing" or "sliding" of the tire along the pavement. This "sliding" is also where you get a "feel" for where the level of traction is at. A slow pace will not do this, hence you get no darky's and no feel, only dead people.

Hope that makes sense.

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Last edited by ronhix; 04-30-2008 at 01:14 PM.
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post #13 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashwingop View Post
Hey who took that picture.....I'm looking to see if anyone got pictures of me on my new trackbike
The guy named Paul who was just there for fun taking pictures and talking to everyone (I gave him my e-mail). Nice guy...he rides but is inbetween bikes right now.

I don't think there were any professional photogs there; I posted on here and on the STT board to no avail.

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post #14 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:16 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks, Ron.

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Originally Posted by MoTo178 View Post
Werd ....driving over fast guys "darkies" form the previous session does not count!
lol...thanks....that's what I figured since that turn is covered already. If you want to laugh some more, here's a picture of my tire after Sunday (same day).



I'm still at the point where I view shredded (not that mine are) tires as cool, as opposed to just an expense.

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post #15 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:36 PM
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If you want to laugh some more...
Nah, I'm not laughing at you. Just making sure my post was read jokingly. I don't get to laugh at anyone, since I don't even have streetbike anymore. I'm just bitter and jealous that you guys are out there getting to melt tires.

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post #16 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
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.... A slow pace will not do this, hence you get no darky's and no feel, only dead people.
Awesome !

Note to myself - need to stop seeing dead people and start working on the corner speed

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post #17 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:48 PM
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Here's what my tire looked like after Saturday. 50 degrees + pirelli slicks= cold tearing. This tire had only one other day on them, Grattan at the end of last season. Also another cooler day. Note to self, don't waste expensive rubber on cold trackdays...



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post #18 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:51 PM
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Neat site with tire wear information:

http://crstuning.com/tire-wear.html
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post #19 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 01:53 PM
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What compound was that Nolan? And what PSI were you runnning?

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post #20 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhix View Post
What compound was that Nolan? And what PSI were you runnning?
Medium compound, 28 psi cold per the NESBA Pirelli sheet, i used tire warmers too. Any suggestions Ron?

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post #21 of 38 (permalink) Old 04-30-2008, 03:01 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoTo178 View Post
Werd ....driving over fast guys "darkies" form the previous session does not count!





On a 2nd note, they are very wet.
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post #22 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 09:09 AM
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Medium compound, 28 psi cold per the NESBA Pirelli sheet, i used tire warmers too. Any suggestions Ron?
On a cold day, 28psi cold may be too high, the jump in pressure is a lot higher from cold to hot. I had my rear tire set last weekend to about 28psi cold and after putting the warmers on they shot up to about 36 or 37psi. Then you have too much pressure + going out on a cold track = cold tearing, in my uninformed opinion.

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post #23 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
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Medium compound, 28 psi cold per the NESBA Pirelli sheet, i used tire warmers too. Any suggestions Ron?
Yeah, Autobahn is a SC1 track. You will have problems with any other compound there.

I know this sounds counter-intuitive and I really can't explain why this works this way but I go UP in pressure to cure cold tearing. Try it next time.

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post #24 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 09:24 AM
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I laid down a darky just a few minutes ago. Then I flushed the toilet.

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post #25 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 09:32 AM
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I've layed down a darky in my shorts before in that corner...

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post #26 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhix View Post
Yeah, Autobahn is a SC1 track. You will have problems with any other compound there.

I know this sounds counter-intuitive and I really can't explain why this works this way but I go UP in pressure to cure cold tearing. Try it next time.
Interesting, totally the opposite of what I was thinking. Might try that at the end of the season if we have some more cold days.

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post #27 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhix View Post
Yeah, Autobahn is a SC1 track. You will have problems with any other compound there.

I know this sounds counter-intuitive and I really can't explain why this works this way but I go UP in pressure to cure cold tearing. Try it next time.
That sounds like it makes sense. Too little air would create more flex/friction heating the tire up TOO much... so in the colder temps a few more pounds would help avoid this...

interesting. Trying to store this in my memory.
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post #28 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 11:39 AM
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And of course, it could be a suspension problem Nolan.

1. Check your sag
2. Push on the rear of the bike and make sure rebound is in the ball park (not too fast or too slow).
3. Set compression somewhere in the middle
4. Use a tire temp gauge (~$100 or so) to actually make sure the tire is operating within its designed operating temperature range.

I know this seems like a lot, but it is far cheaper than chewed up race tires.

HTH

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post #29 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonGu View Post
On a cold day, 28psi cold may be too high, the jump in pressure is a lot higher from cold to hot. I had my rear tire set last weekend to about 28psi cold and after putting the warmers on they shot up to about 36 or 37psi. Then you have too much pressure + going out on a cold track = cold tearing, in my uninformed opinion.
I noticed this last year too at the last Grattan day. I tried lowering the hot pressure to around 34-35. It didn't help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhix View Post
Yeah, Autobahn is a SC1 track. You will have problems with any other compound there.

I know this sounds counter-intuitive and I really can't explain why this works this way but I go UP in pressure to cure cold tearing. Try it next time.
I'll give that a try next time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhix View Post
And of course, it could be a suspension problem Nolan.

1. Check your sag
2. Push on the rear of the bike and make sure rebound is in the ball park (not too fast or too slow).
3. Set compression somewhere in the middle
4. Use a tire temp gauge (~$100 or so) to actually make sure the tire is operating within its designed operating temperature range.

I know this seems like a lot, but it is far cheaper than chewed up race tires.

HTH
I had my suspension set by superbike italia last year. Rear sag was spot on. I could use some slightly stronger fork springs though. I'll pick up a tire temp guage too. What tire temp range is recommended for pirelli slicks or supercorsas? I'll have my bike at Putnam on Sunday for new tires. If you have time, could you take a look at my suspension?

To get back on topic, I left some massive darkies in Turn 5 and through the Turn 8-9-10 complex.

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post #30 of 38 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nolan1300 View Post
I had my suspension set by superbike italia last year.
I was eating tires at the end of 2005 and a simple routine service (freshening up ) of the suspension front and rear solved the problem instantly. Just one more thing to consider.

It never ends does it!

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To get back on topic, I left some massive darkies in Turn 5 and through the Turn 8-9-10 complex.
We demand pics for proof.

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