Tire Sizes on Track - Chicagoland Sportbikes
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:13 AM Thread Starter
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Tire Sizes on Track

Hey hey hey, a member brought something to my attention that I never thought about.

.... so fair warning - retard question ahead .....


I have a 190 on my rear. What's the difference over a 180?

And/Or, is this bike model/rim specific?

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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catwlights View Post
I have a 190 on my rear. What's the difference over a 180?

And/Or, is this bike model/rim specific?
Mo' smarter people will answer this, but yes, it's mostly wheel size specific. A 190 is wider than a 180 and can effect how a bike handles. Depending on wheel size, you can use different widths but it will effect how your bike handles, for instance my turd bike comes with a 110 in front and 150 in the back, but you can't get good rubbers in that size so I use 120/160 (Actually, I take that back, I have a non-stock front wheel which is why I can run a 120) Narrower usually means better turn in. Then again, you need bigger, wider tires on more powerful bikes to be able to handle power output. Big wheels on small bikes are unnecessary though, and just add weight and make it harder to turn.

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Last edited by truckstop; 06-17-2008 at 11:24 AM.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:24 AM Thread Starter
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Im wondering if my specific model was delivered with this tire size for performance reasoning or what???

Am I going to corner just as good on a 190? (well Im still slow, so, but still)

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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:29 AM
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That part I don't know (and I should learn since I'm getting a 600RR lol).
I'm actually surprised you have a 190, as I thought most 600s use 180?

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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:30 AM
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The 190 rear tire is both wider and taller than a 180. If you're on a 600, it more than likely came with a 180 rear tire.

There are different opinions on this, but in my experience with Pirellis you should have no issues switching to the 190 rear (this may not be the case with other brands). Depending on the geometry of your bike, you may have to play with ride height but in the end it depends on the setup that works for you.

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Last edited by spyder84; 06-17-2008 at 11:39 AM.
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:37 AM
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And in terms of performance, the 190 rear will give you a wider contact patch at lean. Some say it will make the bike harder to turn in, but that was never an issue for me. Depending on the how aggressive your geometry is setup it may cause headshake. But if you already ran it without issues, I wouldn't worry about it.

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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:40 AM
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That bike shouldn't have come with a 190 tire on it. Better double check.
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:42 AM Thread Starter
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Im trying to think if my bike came with the 190 now.....

dang it, who has a stock 07 rr tire and can check for me?

I bought the set of corsa III's from Michelle, and I wonder if they were 190 cause she had that GSXR 1K. But, they were fine when I used them, I think, I mean I wouldnt know unless I compared to a 180.

I just bought some power pilots to replace my wearing corsa's. I got a 190 rear, cause that's what I was running. I hope a 190 isn't going to be a bad idea for me out there when Im pushing it this season.

Of course, a tire only lasts so long, so I can switch to a 180, but in the mean time - My biggest concern is safety that matches my skill level.

A pro can probably run whatever and still be fine. I'm sooooooooo not pro. I need all the training wheels I can get with my baby steps. LOL

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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:44 AM
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Some people like the 190.
This is a nice example of a 180 and 190 on the same rim.


You'll be fine.

And these are the specs from the Honda web site.
Front Tire 120/70ZR-17 radial
Rear Tire 180/55ZR-17 radial
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catwlights View Post
Im trying to think if my bike came with the 190 now.....

dang it, who has a stock 07 rr tire and can check for me?

I bought the set of corsa III's from Michelle, and I wonder if they were 190 cause she had that GSXR 1K. But, they were fine when I used them, I think, I mean I wouldnt know unless I compared to a 180.

I just bought some power pilots to replace my wearing corsa's. I got a 190 rear, cause that's what I was running. I hope a 190 isn't going to be a bad idea for me out there when Im pushing it this season.

Of course, a tire only lasts so long, so I can switch to a 180, but in the mean time - My biggest concern is safety that matches my skill level.

A pro can probably run whatever and still be fine. I'm sooooooooo not pro. I need all the training wheels I can get with my baby steps. LOL
Stock is a 180

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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:46 AM Thread Starter
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Next tire, Im trying the 180 on a Pilot Power to see if I can feel anything different.

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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:58 AM
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My CBRXX calls for a 180. I tried a 190 once in a pinch. Although this bike never sees track duty, here is what I noticed:

Resistance to initial turn in was higher. Resistance to adding lean angle was also higher, especially if I wasn't leaned over far to begin with.

Transition from mild lean angle to moderate seemed less stable than with the 180.

The bike felt a bit happier in high speed sweepers with substantial lean.

After seeing the sweet chart Blake posted, it all makes perfect sense.
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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake View Post
Some people like the 190.
This is a nice example of a 180 and 190 on the same rim.

That depends on the profile of the tire. A 190/55 tire compared to 180/55 tire is wider and taller on a 5.5 inch wheel.

That pic is most likely at 190/50 vs. 180/55 on a 5.5 inch wheel. In which case, I could see the bike being harder to turn in as it would flatten out the geometry.

at least that's my understanding of it.

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 12:00 PM
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180 is cheaper usually, so if the bike calls for one and no one has a compelling reason to go to 190(on the cbr600RR) I'd just stick with the 180 unless you got some real cheap decent 190 takeoffs.

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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 12:02 PM Thread Starter
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I have a hard time with upper body strength. (if you've ever seen me, you'd understand. lol)

If I start to pick up speed this year, I'll take this into consideration with tire size.

I would think that a tire size would be comparable to air levels in tires as far as performance. I mean, even look at those tiny little weights they use to balance tires.

Im sure its all relevant.

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post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 12:03 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vcook View Post
180 is cheaper usually, so if the bike calls for one and no one has a compelling reason to go to 190(on the cbr600RR) I'd just stick with the 180 unless you got some real cheap decent 190 takeoffs.
Well I got the corsas from Michelle for $100 bucks. lol So can't beat that.

And I just ordered the other, too late to go back with the time crunch Im in this week, so I'll run it and see how it goes. Yea. the 190 set was more pricey.

(I have so much to learn)

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post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 12:13 PM
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07 600RR's come with 180s
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post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 12:57 PM
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I've run 180/55 and 190/50 on the track (190/55) are too tall and cause some clearance issues with the rear fender. Bottom line- Im not fast enough or skilled enough to tell the difference with either. Run what you got as long as they are in good shape. (I am assuming you are just starting)

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post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 01:04 PM
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My 996 when sold here in the states came with a 190 rear. The same bike sold in Europe had a 180 rear. Gregg @ MCC explained to me Ducati did it to promote bike sales here in the states. I have a 180 on there now, and plan to keep 180 on there.
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post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 01:27 PM
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it's been said a few times, but here again for reinforcement 07 comes with 180.

there was a track seminar at 4&6 earlier this year where they talked about the rear tire size. they actually recomended using the 190 as the rear and actually using slicks. why compromise the traction.

i asume with all the track days you have done, you are not running your stock dunlops. so last time you changed tires, you bought the 190.

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post #21 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 03:24 PM
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Wow, too much info for most people to digest.

The short answer is ride the 180. It is more stable, easier to ride, and unless you are REALLY hard on the gas at full lean angle, there is little to no benefit to riding a 190 on a 600.

More complex answer is that 600s come stock with 180 tires and typically 5.5 inch rims. 1000s come stock with 190s and 6 inch rims. This provides a similar relative contact patch (to power, no in reality). If you put a bigger tire on a smaller rim, it squeezes the sides together and is not utilized for its optimum shape (since now it is distroted and taller by squeezing the sides together). By the way, this taller profile can provide more lean angle and more contact patch. HOWEVER, many brands of 190s will not fit on various 600s. Pirellis rin fine on my GSXR 600 and I also experience better drive, but lose a smooth transition from upright to full lean. The distorted profile causes a little stagger as I approach full lean. No big deal, it is just not a completely smooth lean in, at a certain angle, a tiny bit more effort is require for the bike to continue falling into the lean angle.

For me, 180 turns better on a 600, 190 drives better on a 600. If it is down to that last second of skill that you need to gain on the lap time, the choice can make a difference.

Lat year Safety First ran two pro riders on 600s. One ran 180s, the other ran 190s. Choice was dictated by their riding style, specifically, one of the riders got off the bike more than the other. I had a great confversation with Jin Rashid (sp?) abou tthis at Road America last year. He is at 4&6 if anyone has any questions, or the Saftey First guys maybe able to comment on this difference at tonights event.

Anyone think that this horse is getting beat to death yet?

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post #22 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 03:31 PM
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If you run a 600 with a 190 rear, what do you have to do to the fork tubes not to get a shake at top speeds?














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post #23 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 03:39 PM
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Personally, I didn't get any head shake running 190 Pirellis on my 06 GSXR 600. I would think that if you used a taller tire, that it might force more wight forward, so you would raise the front end to keep the bike as flat as possible for stability.

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post #24 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-17-2008, 09:48 PM
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Raise the fronts to compensate.

J/K

Stick with what comes on the bike, if the manufacture wanted you to have a 10 on a 600 they would have put one on it.

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