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Grand Master Crash
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Check THESE A-HOLES out...

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/story.hts/topstory2/1539629

I say we bring back the guillotine, and "handle" every one of the punk-ass cops that were involved in this - except for the cop that actually issued the raid. I say we give him a slow, painful death.

Don't you just LOVE how cops seem to enjoy handling a group of kids as some massive gathering of serious criminals?
 

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Yeah, I think there was actually a post on SBN from some Houston people about this that I read. If I'm right, they raided the parking lot, arrested those 400 something people, towed over 100 cars, etc. because it was a hangout for, uh, street racers and whatever. :rolleyes
 

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Grand Master Crash
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I just don't understand how people hanging out in a parking lot can be considered illegal? Regardless of where it is. It pisses me off when I'm down at 19/Barrington BS'ing and hanging out with friends, and the cops come through and bitch everybody out. True, we set up streetraces there, I won't argue that. But we aren't doing the racing there. Shit, we're not even doing the racing in the same town - or same COUNTY half the time. We aren't selling drugs. We aren't causing problems. We're just standing around, talking.

Isn't there something in the constitution about "the right to congregate"?

I tell ya... if I was one of those that was arrested, mistreated, stereotyped, and detained, being a legitimate customer of an establishment during their REGULAR business hours - I'd be suing the SHIT out of the local PD!!!
 

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OmniGLH said:
I tell ya... if I was one of those that was arrested, mistreated, stereotyped, and detained, being a legitimate customer of an establishment during their REGULAR business hours - I'd be suing the SHIT out of the local PD!!!
True that.

I wasn't disagreeing with you about the unjustness of these arrests or anything, either, btw. It seems a little bit different and, of course, more extreme in the case of the Houston kids, but I think it just comes down to the business owner not wanting everyone to gather there. I know that in Gurnee at the Taco Bell every Friday or Saturday night, they get real pissed at all the kids standing around filling up their parking lot waiting to go race. Same thing happens downtown when people used to race by Doty Rd.--they'd kick people out of the gas station and that closed tire shop 'cause the business owners don't want people there who are just loitering and whatever.
 

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Man that story has me pissed off. Especially the 10 year old girl.

I wonder if they arrested "everybody" to insure that no one would claim discrimination. Not that it matters anyways, they can't do shit to you like that. Just because you're in a crowd of potential law breakers, does not make you guilty of anything. AHHHH!!! Assholes. I wonder what they accomplished by that. They totally ruined public/PD relations down there and probably benefited little in actual arrests of wanted felons.

A slow death (as stated above) is justified, very justified.

PS On a local note...

I don't know if this is the case this year, but it certainly was last year. Strat's in Franklin Park (Mannheim and Grand Ave):

Because of all the congregations of cars/bikes spilling over into a lot other than that of strats (bunch of businesses which are closed at night anyways) they put up signs. They were mounted a good 10-12 feet up on lamp post and very long. If you read the print, it said that they would put a boot, a fucking boot on your car if you parked there and went to strats. Cost to free your car, over $100. The fucking cops would show up with a minivan full of these boots and just lay there waiting. You could park next to them and they wouldn't say shit. You walk over 50 feet to strats and, bam, car immobilized until you pay. Not as bad as arresting hundreds of people for nothing, but certainly a bunch of crap. Ok, i'm done. Off the soap box.....
 

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You guys only read whats put infront of you.

I'd bet money that more went on at the place then what the reporters list. You all know that the media is a twisted force, that can make anything look whatever way they wanted it to.

Most likely, there was some fairly bad stuff going on there and thats why the raid was originally planned out. Cops don't just get together enough officers to arrest 400 people, unless it's a serious issue. Buglray, drugs, hassling customers constantly.. it could be ANYTHING, but the media will not tell you about that.. the media wants it to look like it's 100 percent BAD COPS so thats how it will look.

All I'm saying is try to read in between the lines, and don't take everything you read as truth.. there is almost always somthing that someone left out.

Certainly, the mentioned cases are out of line.. but until the entire scenario is revealed, there is no way to totally pass judgement on the coppers for doing what they are ordered to do.

Media sucks ass.
 

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In case anyone is interested, here's the thread from SBN. I think there were some actual Houston people posting in it, so maybe it gives more background info.

http://www.sportbikes.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=97141

Mike, of course I couldn't really say for sure, but I don't think there was anything very serious going on in the parking lot that warrented such a raid. No major drug slinging or anything like that, I mean.
 

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Well the arrest record of that day are public record. It shouldn't be too hard to figure out if the percentage of drug arrests or drugs confiscated are appropriate.

Arresting EVERYONE around is STILL overkill, as you will see if it happens to you.
 

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OmniGLH said:

Isn't there something in the constitution about "the right to congregate"?
Not on private property. I'm sure there were signs posted to the effect of "no loitering" or else the PD/Kmart/Sonic would have no basis.

I liked the story. I think more teens need a night or two in jail. It shows that society is nothing like their spineless parents.

I've been able to stay out of jail for 31 years, and am able to identify where I should, and should not be. I doubt the expose on the select few detainees were completely objective, and I also doubt that they were completely innocent. The straight A student should have been able to read the no loitering sign.

Brian
 

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Brian said:

The straight A student should have been able to read the no loitering sign.
Neglecting the fact that loitering is a pretty lame charge to begin someone's arrest record, and neglecting the fact that (according to the report) some had just been shopping there, you MAY want to consider before you get too righteous about this that most citys have some form of loitering law.

While we don't know all the facts here, it's pretty likely that many of these bystanders were smoking and throwing their butts on the ground even though trash receptacles were nearby, drinking beverages and throwing their containers on the ground, etc. We've all seen the smoke shows that can result from a group of people encouraging the muscle cars.

The result is that an otherwise harmless gathering of people (teens) turns into a nuisance or noise, littering, and general mischief problem.

I will be the first in line to speak out to protect the right of free assembly, but if you assemble and have no respect for your surroundings, what exactly do you EXPECT to happen when the community gets tired of your crap and complains to the police?
 

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Furthermore, this countries police force is asked to deal with/take out the trash, and deal with the dregs of society. So if there are a few false arrests, or a little corporal punishment administered from time to time, we cry “FOUL”. Try looking at it from the cops perspective, and they do it for minimal wages! Or the business owners perspective, dealing with throngs of teenagers, obviously turning away potential higher paying patrons. I am not an advocate for police by any stretch, but it’s a dirty job that needs to be done. Maybe we could all be law abiding citizens, thereby making an organized police force obsolete.

I think that is about $.18
Brian
 

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Brian said:
Furthermore, this countries police force is asked to deal with/take out the trash, and deal with the dregs of society. So if there are a few false arrests, or a little corporal punishment administered from time to time, we cry “FOUL”. Try looking at it from the cops perspective, and they do it for minimal wages! Or the business owners perspective, dealing with throngs of teenagers, obviously turning away potential higher paying patrons. I am not an advocate for police by any stretch, but it’s a dirty job that needs to be done. Maybe we could all be law abiding citizens, thereby making an organized police force obsolete.

I think that is about $.18
Brian
I agree with you and Dave. Unfortunately getting the short end of the stick really sucks. I know I would be pissed if I was arrested while taking my wife out for ice cream. I just hope the justice system straightens out who were the perpetrators and who were the unfortunate innocent bystanders. An arrest on these kids records could mean the difference of getting a scholarship or not, or even getting into some of the private colleges. That could be detrimental to some innocent kids future.:nono
 

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Who's faster Lupi
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I'm with Mike on this one. At least for now. I tend to not beleive whole heartedly anything in the news until it is co-oberated (sp) by other sources. Too many get the story out now get the headlines while you can.
 

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Crazy said:


I agree with you and Dave.
Actually, I think my views are different than Brian's. However I was trying to illustrate how people failing to be responsible citizens can contribute to the community asking for action from the police.

If the people assembling are having little negative impact, then there's little justification for hassling them, other than the excercise of authority of course.

Using the excuse of private property to stifle rights is a very tricky area when the private property in question is a business that is open to the public. The black-and-white thinking becomes more gray, and SHOULD be more gray in a free society.
 

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Grand Master Crash
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Ok well now that I've had a day to cool off over this, I don't feel as 'militant'. I'm sure 400+ HS kids can get to be a bit of a hassle. We all know how disrespectful teens can be when it comes to general public behavior, littering, etc.

I guess I took offense to it somewhat based on my personal experience. We generally try to keep the lots clean, chew out the punks that make a mess, etc... because we KNOW that's the big reason why the owners of the parking lots complain. It's generally the young, HS-aged kids that are the biggest pain. You know that the McD's on 19/Barrington actually COMPLAINED to the POLICE about them kicking us out? Their business dropped BIG time once we all stopped hanging out there. I'm sure SONIC makes some serious bank with all the kids hanging out there. But whatever.

The line about cutting cops a break, because of the slime they deal with, IMO is just total BS. I don't feel sympathy for them, not one bit... it's their CHOSEN profession. Boo-hoo, I have to deal with the scum of the earth... fine. Don't like it, do something else. NO ONE is forcing them to be police officers. Just because they have to deal with crappy people on a day-to-day basis, is NO excuse to treat EVERYONE like a POS.

Just my opinion.
 

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BusaDave said:

If the people assembling are having little negative impact, then there's little justification for hassling them, other than the excercise of authority of course.
True, publicly.....but, this is private property.
 

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habitual line stepper
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Brian said:
Not on private property. I'm sure there were signs posted to the effect of "no loitering" or else the PD/Kmart/Sonic would have no basis.

I liked the story. I think more teens need a night or two in jail. It shows that society is nothing like their spineless parents.

I've been able to stay out of jail for 31 years, and am able to identify where I should, and should not be. I doubt the expose on the select few detainees were completely objective, and I also doubt that they were completely innocent. The straight A student should have been able to read the no loitering sign.

Brian
Brian, I disagree wholeheartedly! I would suggest that you wouldn't feel the same way had it been you they arrested, or maybe your wife, sister, daughter...

So you've been lucky up until now. What happens tomorrow when they do stop you, and throw you in jail for a night and let you worry about sorting it out? Maybe you'll pull into strats to get a burger and they arrest everyone. You knew not to be there, right?

So you think that loitering should be punishable with a night in jail. What's next? You don't speed do you?
 

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Grand Master Crash
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I give every officer I meet the benefit of the doubt... and I honestly believe that a majority of the police officers out there ARE doing it for the right reasons.

But that still leaves a large number of officers out there, who have taken the job simply for the power aspects. They hate the job, hate the pay, and hate anyone who has it better than them. And, unfortunately, anyone who makes more than $35k a year, most likely has it better than them. So they take it out on everyone.
 

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Jack said:


Brian, I disagree wholeheartedly! I would suggest that you wouldn't feel the same way had it been you they arrested, or maybe your wife, sister, daughter...

So you've been lucky up until now. What happens tomorrow when they do stop you, and throw you in jail for a night and let you worry about sorting it out? Maybe you'll pull into strats to get a burger and they arrest everyone. You knew not to be there, right?

So you think that loitering should be punishable with a night in jail. What's next? You don't speed do you?
Hmmm let's see.....
1) Staying out of jail has nothing to do with luck.
2) Strat's wants us there.
3) Loitering=night in jail...I do not make up the rules/laws.. I just follow the rules/laws......should I break the rules/laws,and get caught, I should be punished appropriately.

Your reaction is not terribly uncommon...none of us are to be expected to be accountable for our own actions.
 
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